Should Gordon Brown go?
He's lost another member of his Cabinet, the Work and Pensions Secretary James Purnell has quit. He's warning the Prime Minister that the longer he stays in charge, the more likely it is the Conservatives will win the next general election.
Should he stand down as Prime Minister or should he fight on? Should he call a general election or just get on with the job?
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5LNPI: Honours and dishonours 30 Dec 09
10:29 Wed, 30 Dec 09
In Thursday's programme we'll find out who'll be named on the Queen's New Year's Honours list. Recipients usually include people from the world of sport, showbiz celebrities and a smattering of ordinary people who deserve public recognition. But on the phone-in from 9 - we want to know who would be on your New Year's honours list? All are welcome - from your postman to celebs. And also let's not forget those who've spent the year behaving badly - name and shame people by nominating them for our dishonours list.
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They should all go but who will replace them? Not one of the parties represents my views.
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Of course he should go; this government is dead in the water. HOWEVER, if the Labour Party think they can install a new leader and not have an immediate general election they should think again. We need a general election now.
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How much have you lot reported on any burning issues surrounding these elections...hardly at all..concentrating as you have done since he came to power, on hounding this man continually till hes out of office. His steadfastness and integrity has shown you all up and I hope that when Cameron is in power you are as uncircumspect when attacking him with no real reason!!! Shame on you!!!
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very curious indeed . wasnt it the case that during the last elections blair was so unpopular that he had to run on browns popularity (ie anyone but blair). he couldnt be seen without gordon brown at his side.
wasnt it the case that the understanding amongst the electorate and the labour party that blair would step down to give brown an opportunity to become prime minister?
so whats all this nonsense about the moral basis for browns leadership now?
essentially its the last stand of the blairites who have no real support in the country and no credibility inside of the labour movement. its an attempt for a pre emptive coup so that after the next election they have their placeman/women in leadership roles.
not that browns politics offers anything, its as morally lacking as blairs. deceit spin and illegal wars.
interestingly its the usual blairite-neo con backers who are bleating the loudest .. stand up mr murdoch et al.
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"We need a general election now."
no we dont. and what makes you believe that 'devious' daves neo con politics will be any better for this country?
what can anyone else do under the present economic circumstances that brown has not done?
all it appears people are demanding is a change of image, since no party is offering a change in politics ..
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"His steadfastness and integrity"
if he did have any integrity and morality he lost it by collaborating with blair in his deceitful efforts to take us into war of choice and one which is believed to be illegal with respect to UN charter - international law (ref: kofi annan).
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As I have said before, I am not a Conservative or Labour Party member. (Nor Lib Dem, actually).
I feel a bit sorry for Brown, being stabbed so publicly in the back by his own appointees and with them behaving as if it is some sort of student committee they are on rather than the actual government of this country. The sight of Blears with that brooch yesterday was about as juvenile and unsophisticated as you can get; grinning as always like a Cheshire cat, as she delivers her own fatal blow. The resignees have all lost sight of the fact that they are in power, in our country, and they almost more than Brown and his policies are bringing the Labour government in to disrepute.
I agree he remains partly responsible for many things I have found unacceptable, the war in particular, but there is no sense of decorum at all as these rats scurry to position themselves off his ship and on to their own grab for power and position.
I hope they all lose their seats in the next election, it will serve them right.
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Yes Gordon Brown should go now not because he's the problem but to prove to the many who are convinced that he is that's it's New Labour's right wing neoliberal Tory economic policies that are. Whether it be another leader (who the likes of the Murdoch press will appoint) or a newy elected Tory government the underlying economic problems wll still exist and that is a rotten bailed out capitalist system!
Even by the crass standards of political reporting today, Purnell's resignation is particularly cynical as he has always been loyal to the PM until the expense saga exposed him as being a leading culprit!
The likes of Purnell, Milliband, Blair, Woodward (he was an official Tory anyway and jumped ship without a bielection) etc were never true Labour politicians anyway and were only attracted into the party throughout the 80's and 90's because it adopted Tory right wing policies to get elected. It provided a good vehicle for them to be Tories without being in the Tory party.
The real crisis afflicting UK politics today therefore is it is now quite likely another Tory government will be elected on the record of their own failed policies by New Labour!
Incidentally Nicky. 'Joc'ular and talented as a presenter you are, it makes no odds who you voted for because none of the parties differ anyway!
One good ironic point stemming from the the gains the far right like the BNP have made! At least it may provide the media an excuse to bring them more onto the political stage so that voters can witness first hand how, apart from immigration and race how utterly exhausted they are over policy and how as glorified Tories they just play on voter apathy and confusion!
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Nicky, of course GB will stay, we wont have an election while they can be collecting their ministerial salaries!
Gordon will not win an election because i believe it is untenable to have an MP as Prime Minister (or even a cabinet minister) that represents a constituency not subject to the laws and regulations that parliament passes. Labour passed devolution and will have to live with it.
Warren Bresler
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Oh Darling your staying,clutching at straw.i fear it will not be long before we find out Gordon is a EXPM
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Nicky - why did you let that man be rude to that lady and talk over her? Get control of your programme.
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Mr Brown can still win an election if he has the courage to bring this appalling government to an end. The electorate would be very supportive of anyone who now gives them the right to give vent to their anger. He should force the Conservatives to face the reality check of a General Election. The Electorate has not forgotten why they refused to vote Tory at the last election. All is not lost for Gordon Brown unless he fails to come out fighting. The minute he called an election the Labour Party would swing behind him, they have no alternative suitable candidate. When the moment arrives for people to chose for whom to vote the Labour Party is every bit as electable as the Conservatives- it does not matter who wins-they are both irretrievably linked to corruption. Its the Nation that will continue to lose as always.
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It's just just his mismanagement of the UK economy, his failure to deal with crime, educational standards etc. It's not just that he keeps billions and billions of PFI and public sector pension debt off the books. It's not just that he appears to be a dithering, weak and ineffective PM. It's not just that he sold off our gold cheap. It's not just that he returned to boom and bust. He also reneged on the Lisbon treaty vote.
Gordon Browns economic miricle was based on massive borrowings. It was an illusion and we still have fools believing he is some kind of economic messiah. We are really in the **** and he must go. We have to face up to the mess we are in.
And I haven't mentioned flooding the country with unskileld and low paid immigrants!
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
We did not vote for Gordon Brown to be Prime Minister and should now have the chance to decide for ourselves. This government has no credibility and should hold a general election now.
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I don't think Gordon Brown should go. Too many people are jumping on the band wagon without considering the alternatives. There is no credible alternative and I don't relish the prospect of a conservative government led by David Cameron, who has little experience, few ideas and no new policies. I have little respect for a leader who just walks the walk and talks the talk, continually engaging in Punch and Judy polictics and cheap soundbites.
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I agree with one of your callers today re if Gordon Brown showed morality and told the likes of Darling and others to go regardless of their commitment to him, he would earn my respect. He is allowing those who should have known what they were doing re expenses to get away with their frauds.
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Whatever is said there are some basic truths here. Brown plotted for 10 years to oust Blair in a covert, underhand and relentless operation, which eventually succeeded. The reason was simply that Brown wanted to be head of the gang. That is it. No reference in his neurotic drive for the lead role to the interests of the UK, just Brown's desire. And this is how he runs the UK: for the benefit of Brown. He is desperate to stay in power and I cannot see him ever calling a general election, such is his thirst for power. If he stays in power, he will spend the next year buying votes. He will do this by spending public money on creating needless public sector jobs, increasing and extending welfare, generally throwing our money at anything to secure those crucial votes. In his lust for power, he will well and truely bankrupt this country for decades. This is why he must go: he operates in his own interests, not those of the country. And he is ruthless and treacherous in his lust for power.
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Over the last 11 years Labour has been profligate with our money and now the economic downturn is impacting, they are resorting to drastic unproven policies in a despreate attemp to make it look like they know what they're doing. In fact, they know nothing and most economic observers agree that their policies were foolhardy. What's needed now is a rise in interest rates to 1%. Why? Because the exchange rate is storing up inflationary pressure and a minor increase would redress the balance in the UKs favour.
The blame for the poor UK economic situation lies squarely with Gordon. As Chancellor, he dictated economic policy and he continued to do so as PM, believing he knew what he was doing better than anyone else. Deluded, he know thinks he knows he can get the UK out of his mess so he'll stay on until the bitter end. When the Tories win the next election, they'll reveal the true extent of Gordons appalling leadership and hopefully he be so embarassed he'll emigrate! Certainly Gordon is very likely to end as the most unpopular PM ever - a fitting end to an inglorious career.
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Everyone should take a step back...If Gordon Brown goes what good will this do at this point...The Conservatives are using the opportunity of the labour's in-fighting to recruit panic voters.
We should not rush into electing a new government who are using this media storm to get into power.
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I agree with the grass roots supporter regarding the hazel blears, james purnell & jacqui smith - who do they think they are? Who were they before Gordon brought them into the cabinet - these people's egos are bigger than themselves. It is upto the constituencies to decide if a mp should have stepped down from their position inthe cabinet - after all it was the these people that voted them in to parliament. Did any of them consult their voters - no they probably didn't! If they sostrongly disagree with policies etc the couragous thing is to fight from with in - not throw you toys out of the pram - these people were cought with their fingers in the till andare using the media to try and deflect these facts away fromthe spotlight
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What's the problem about hounding him from office, he and his henchmen forced out a successful standing PM one year after winning an election (which Brown would bever have won) and now Blair's revenge is been exacted. It's politics!
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The problem is that Gordon and his crew have made such a hash of running Britain that there are no easy answers left. Yes, he should go and a General Election should be called but we really need some radical changes in this country to save us from bankruptcy.
The taxation system needs to be overhauled, government spending needs curbing, education and the NHS need to be corrected and above all our economy needs to be rebalanced.
The rise of the BNP is a frightening indication of the frustration of the ordinary Briton and if some strong medicine is not taken soon then they could be a real threat to our democracy.
Gordon's crash has presented us with an opportunity for some radical surgery.
We should withdraw from the EU immediately and send all the Eastern European Nationals home. All quangos should be disbanded - parliament is enough of a talking shop. Schools should be run on a payment by results (i.e.value added) basis and teachers rewarded in that manner.
Above all the taxation system needs to be altered so that the black economy is closed down and people are properly rewarded for their business acumen which creates real jobs. Perhaps we should abandon Income Tax and put it all on VAT - this would also encourage people to save?
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Lord Sugar - Yet another un-elected person on the gravy train!
I wonder if he will have the lumps to say "Gordon your'e fired"
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We do not need a general Election.many voters would vote based on hysteria and a knee jerk reaction.
I remember well being on the Finance committee of a very successful Comprehensive school during the Tory years.The school, and thousands like it, was almost forced into three day weeks because of the relentless cuts.We were not even able to make routine repairs.
When Labour was elected the difference was almost immediate.
Remember all ye ordinary people of Britain that when Tories say "we will give people more choice" that means "if you want it you will have to pay for it".
Perhaps Gordon should go, but Cameron or Clegg--what a sick joke to play on this wonderful country.
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More faces watched on BBC and Sky News. And what a lot of storys behind them. And the Met Police making no move - again. MoPs expenses, I mean. What did you think I meant, Harriet? lol
You hang on in there Gordon I thought after a woman called Siobhan McDonagh came onto my screen with a remarkable face telling me seemingly he - Mr Brown - was winning against the drip drip of all his Partys gainsayers.
James Parnell was an odd exit - explained by one newspaper as "I have resigned - now you (Brown) follow"
Who is running Great Britain I wondered?
Liam Fox, Sarah Teather. Fox? Teather? lol
No Gordon - having just walked away when Daily Telegrah man came on BBC TV News - laughing I was. Mister Brown - you hang on in there, mate.
The next General Election - winning - will be a big ask - but this "General Election - NOW! NOW!" chant - still makes no sense when everything is in flux. Unless......
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G Brown
Imho your not the perfect PM, but alas i still believe your the only man upto the Job at present so hang in there.
Let the rats leave the ship 'hopefully' they wont swim far before sinking without trace'.
Get in a fresh crew who are willing to support you.
Then maybe you can continue to steer the UK out of this god awful mess we are in.
Ps just one thing,
You shouldn't have sold the gold
BIG Mistake.
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One hopes that all the callers put on air and writers on here who think that Gordon Brown should have been personally elected as Prime Minister are up in arms about unelected businessman and celebrity Alan Sugar being brought into the government!
By the same token are they calling for each Cabinet post like Health Secretary, Chancellor, Foreign Secretary to be elected?
What about electing the Governor of the Bank of England, or the Director General of the BBC. They exert far more power and influence over our everyday lives than servile careerists politicians in government or on the backbenches!
Conclusion! It's not leaders of people that should be elected. It should be competing ideas and policies that people can relate to the world about them!
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Absolutely he should go. Brown is at the helm of a sinking ship and after the Election results hasn't got the moral authority to run the country.
He would be far better thought of he called for a General Election.
Why isn't he listening to the Electorate, after all he promised he would after last years By-Election defeats.
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House Prices going UP again...
FTSE is UP...
Pound is UP...
Economy is getting better...
UK consumer optimism 'increases'....
Shoud G. Brown go now !
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Ok, now labour know they must go, how ever the next Goverment needs to know that the people of England are fed up with the goverment not carrying out the wishes of the people, no more ripping us off with taxes, no more fuel taxes, no more bloody speed cameras, give the country back to the poeple of this country, It use to be a nice place to live, now it's just an over taxed police state, run by corrupt MP's
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last night at 20 past 10 brown was the best thing since slice bread but when brown did not give her a upgrade part of the new shuffle she threw her toys out of the pram im glad brown gave her the boot and made her walk cos she did not get the job she wanted the labour party will regroup and galvanise itself and brown will come back stronger the bottom line is the torries would be no better
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I think Brown should stay - He is the best asset the consevatives have.
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So today is the D Day Commemoration and I watched it with mixed feeling. Respect and puzzlement. Certain politicians and statesmen there I suppose.
And the English Derby. No enjoyment left I am afraid. In watching horse racing even. Numb with the past few weeks if not years. Seeing Stars more like. Great horse though.
D Day. Remembering them all - those with us still and those not. With the former -hearing their stories.
That stuff is and was important (MoPs - "they want the Infantry to go over the top" on PM just now?)
How dare they! I sigh
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I was in China 6 months ago and they have closed 35,000 in the last 18 months. Go to Shanghai and you will see masses of freight ships and containers sitting still and some of these haven't moved in 2 years. The point is there is a GLOBAL recession and this is not down to Brown.
I am tired of people who do anything other than read red tops moaning about Brown as if he personally caused this problem.
This Labour government has caused many, many problems which really anger me like losing control of our boarders (but was was Blairs doing really), not making sure the banks were doing their jobs properly, not being able to run MP's expenses properly...but I cannot think of one person who is better placed to take us forward and out of this mess than Brown. If anyone can tell me of one I would like to here who that is but lets be serious that person is not Cameron. I mean if anyone suggests he can run this country then I may as well stop trying to convince my kids they should stay in the UK and work hard for themselves and the country.
Just tell me any one person who would be better the Brown. He maybe the best of a bad lot but he is the best. He should come out and be himself and get on with what he believes in rather than trying to be a media player. Lets face it we had enough deception with the last guy!
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If you had the real belief in your convictions and believe you have the solutions to help this country through a recession, then put your arguments to the test and call a GENERAL ELECTION. Oh no sorry, I forgot democracy is no longer part of our political system. Could have sworn that one of the characteristics of a liberal democracy that no government believes it holds the absolute truth; yet, we have a unelected prime minister who is so arrogant he refuses to have an election in case the tories get in! Mandelson, Haine, Sugar, Kinnock, Ardonis and many more are all unelected ministers, with no accountability making important decisions on our behalf.
Gord help us all because next they will bring in proportional representation which only favours minority parties and the outgoing government. You only have to look at local councils with no overall control to see what a mess they get in. GENERAL ELECTION NOW and if Labour get back in, fair enough, but at least they would have a democratic mandate for their policies.
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BBC. A story that cannot be told - I am told.
The Right did well. UKIP. BNP. The Right did well in Europe too? In Holland? In Finland?
The BNP voted into representing my country in Europe - just one day after commemorating the anniversary of D-Day.
I am done. These proceedings are at an end.
Subject: his party will keep talking about budging him - well it certainly has got some stamina meet your maker
Anagram: BT Paul - Hilltop - Damian Green Kith wig - I bug Sky legitimate L clan waste shy moor saint rum key a meteor
Oh and Sky. Don't worry. You and Britain and the Beeb deserve each other. A country run by Lawyers.
Take care Shelagh and Nicky. I plan just to sneer until I leave these shores.
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wish these labour MPs would stop saying they lost because of the expenses scandal, no its because of their high taxes,stealth taxes,ID cards, the wars, the spying on the nation,telling us what to eat,drink.how to bring up children!the list goes on, as for a health and safety warning, labour should carry one! "this party can seriously damage your wealth, health and future"
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All this speculation seems to be on good for the fact that the BBC and other broadcasters' reporters and presenters are being kept in a job.
The BBC news at present is going on about some junior minister; who is she, another one the MPs who have used the system for themselves? Bandwagon springs to mind. If she is that god why has it taken her this long to speak up!
All I know is that the state of our country is due to both tory and so-called new labour policies. It is about time the media focused in on this; People are losing their jobs, their homes, taxes are going up, and the state of our roads are a national disgrace.
Go after these MPs ask them what they stand for, ask why they are going on holiday when they end to sort the whole system out and be brought to account; it is no good keep calling for an election, which I want, but the electorate wants to know what system we are voting for, not be given yet more empty promises.
BBC and other broadcasters that is your challenge, do hold them to account; go after them all and stop chasing unknowns or silly gossip for the sake of it!
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Gordon was promoted to his level of incompetence- unqualified - never worked in a proper job -never ran a business- religious fundamentalist, unelected, has brought in a master of deception previously fired for unethical behaviour twice - what do we have here a democracy or a fascist/communist dictatorship milking the treasury?
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Quickstepper:
Strong words!
So getting away from Gordon and personalities, what as a voter is your solution and how would you do thing's differently?
I just read emotional banter and diatribe in your thread and nothing relating to ideas and policy!
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