- 26 Jun 08, 10:12 PM
London
Cesc Fabregas - like the thoroughbred he is - has timed his run perfectly to inspire Spain to victory in Euro 2008.
Fabregas's season at Arsenal has, in some respects, mirrored the fortunes of Spain's national team over so many major tournaments in that huge promise was left unfulfilled when the big prizes were handed out.
This has every chance of changing when Spain face Germany in the final of a superb Euro 2008 in Vienna on Sunday.
And with David Villa a major doubt through injury, Spain will look to Fabregas to repeat a performance in the semi-final win against Russia that was just stunning.
The loss of Villa before half-time could have been a bitter blow to Spain's infamously fragile temperament, but Fabregas did not just come on and compensate for his absence, he improved a top-class side with his brilliance.
It was enough to convince me that Germany, resilient but ordinary if you remove Michael Ballack from the equation, will be beaten by Spain in the final.
Fabregas did not just create goals for Daniel Guiza and David Silva, he formed an instant partnership with Fernando Torres in the same manner Steven Gerrard did at Liverpool in the second half of last season.
He pulled the strings in midfield, but also provided attacking support - and looked the complete midfield package.
It's a dangerous business backing against Germany, but the evidence of our own eyes throughout this tournament suggest Spain are vastly superior, providing they do not fall into the same traps that claimed Portugal in the quarter-final.
I hope Spain go on to win the final because it will be a justified outcome - the best side in the tournament will have emerged triumphant.
They have outstanding players, and while coach Luis Aragones has had his unsavoury moments, he has provided wise leadership here.
He was questioned when he left out Raul and Guti out of his squad, but has been vindicated.
If they play as they can against Germany - and this is nothing personal against Joachim Low's workmanlike side - the competition will get the winners it deserves.
Spain ended up outclassing Russia, leaving Guus Hiddink a loser at the semi-final stage of a big competition yet again, as he was with the Netherlands and South Korea.
After talking up Andrei Arshavin following his display against Sweden, I was left bitterly disappointed by the performance of a player who has become the talk of the tournament.
Maybe all the sudden attention and talk of a move to Barcelona got on top of him and drained him of energy and inspiration, but he was awful - and so many of his previously promising team-mates were no better.
I hope we saw the real Arshavin against Sweden and the Netherlands because he looked lightweight against Spain, but no-one should doubt his ability on the strength of one poor showing.
Russia have shown us rich promise, while Spain have finally turned potential into tangible results.
I hope they can give one last push on Sunday and give a hugely-talented group of players the trophy they deserve.
It's Spain for me - who do you think will win on Sunday?
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Phil, you are forgetting a basic fact; football is two sides of 11 chasing a ball for 90 minutes and Germany WINS.
Something to do with concentration, physical endurance, confidence and a never say die attitude.
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Fabregas invented a new role for himself tonight - maybe if we pick up the same injuries as last year, we can play him as the second striker, with Gilberto, Denilson or Ramsey filling the hole.
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Spain should win the final. As for Fabregas, he needs to realise that he will not win much at Arsenal anymore. A top quality player needs to play for a winning club and Wenger would rather swap ethics for trophies. Get a Mourinho type figure in.
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Throughout the tournament I have been asking people what Fabregas has to do to start a game for spain - the answer seems to be injure one of the front 6, he is almost always first of the subs bench and he nearly always makes something happen, 3 assists and 1 goal in 5 matches speaks for itself considering he's only started one game and played a total of 289 minutes out of a possible 450. He has looked every inch the second best player in Europ this tournament as he has pretty much all year
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Woah, hang on, there's a bandwagon leaving and McNulty isn't on it.
Seriously, Arshavin puts in a great performance and he's the hottest property in Europe.....now Fabregas plays a blinder to propel Spain to the final and now he's the player to win the tournament for Spain. Basically, he has one good game now, ends up on a winning spain side and you're right in your prediction. Great journalistic insight. Well done Phil, it's tough to put your neck on the line just before the final (just for the record, I think Spain and Germany have both had good tournaments so my money is spread equally between them).
Out of interest Phil, was Fabregas (or indeed Arshavin) your pick before the tournament began?
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From Spain, a wonderful win, and I hope we beat Germany. But you are wrong; the best side in this tournament was Holland.
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Fabregas truly deserves all the praise he's getting tonight. Watching him against Russia was reminiscent of Zidane controlling games at the highest level but without the arrogant, 'I don't need to be here' attitude - you can tell this guy loves to play the game and is determined to bring glory to his country. With his vision, awareness, commitment and ability to play the killer ball in the final third he's shown he belongs at football's top table (and how he does it after such a long, hard domestic season i don't know!).
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Also, sorry for another post but, "nobody should doubt the strength of his ability on ONE poor showing" (re Arshavin). Are you kidding? It seems that we're basing a Zidane-esque dynasty on the strength of TWO good showings...am I missing something here?
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come on fabregas!
MASTERCLASS!!!!!!!!!!
that was probably the performance of the tournament. get in there!
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AlexofAlexia, that was a good post but surely Zidane with his 'I couldn't care less attidude' was one of the best players ever to play the professional game? he's better than fabregas surely?
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Sorry, 'I don't need to be here attitude'.
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I'm amazed by the tripe some people write on here.
1. It was mainly the media who talked up Arshavin. I'm sure he's an excellent player, but why do the media have to do this? He had a stinker, and it's the media who went totally over the top.
2. Why do they have to do the same with Fabregas???? He is one of my favourite players, and we all know how good he is, but why do you have to write this crap?? Aren't you all embarassed enough with your predictions about Arshavin (he made his debut in Bradford blah blah ....)
3. Of course Fabregas will win things at Arsenal (i'm a liverpool fan). Arsene Wenger is the only man i'd have to replace Rafa. The enjoyment Wenger's teams style of football brings to proper footy fans is immense - football is a game, and an art form - if its just winning why do the other 17 teams in the PL bother turning up. We may as well just disband the football league if winning the PL is all that matters - get a life those that think that!
4. And i think a bit of Zidane envy going on with the last comment!! i've never heard any of the players who have played with him say a bad word about him, let alone call him arrogant. He's always praised for his team ethic, and he has proven to be best! So a bit of fairness please
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Last post spot on I think. Any arrogance Zidane showed was purely a complete belief in his ability... backed up, I argue, by results and goals in Champs League finals and World Cup finals.
This whole article is silly really. Can I ask a genuine question? Does Phil McNulty really earn a living wrighting predictive columns about games that have just happened? Hindsight is obviously the journalists most powerful tool.
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
And also...why isn't anyone else simply astounded by how well Torres and Fabregas have been playing at the end of a 60+ game season when all we hear from England's premiership players is how exhausted they are come Euros/World Cup time?
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Fair enough, I don't know why I was arguing really. Fabregas is completely quality and it'd be nice to see Spain win just for him.
As a neutral though (with England not being involved) I'm hoping people have been impressed with Ballack, surely player of the tournament (for me)? And, no, I'm not a Chelsea fan.
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Well Ballack has had a good tournament overall but didn't get a kick in the semi against Turkey.
I think the final will tell us who the player of the tournament is, its not very clear at the moment.
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Ballack player of the tournament? you must be having a laugh, he was been decent at best. Dont get me wrong, Germany would miss him if he didnt play but definately not player of the tournament.
The hype from the media around Arshavin meant he could only dissapoint in tonights game. He is a good player though and was brialliant this season for Zenit, look forward to see him in the premier league or la liga next season.
Hope Spain go on to beat Germany. Both teams will probably play the same way with 1 up top and a supporting player behind.
Fabregas hasnt started because its either him or xavi due to the way spain play. Could work in Spains favour if Villa doesnt make it as now Cesc will probably start behind Torres
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Brilliant Spain, yet again. Who's the pillock that said :Spain are the favourites, but its Russia for me. It wasnt McNulty but another of their 'expert journalists'. As someone rightly pointed out, hindsight is a wonderful thing.
As much as Germany are resilient, Fabregas supporting Torres will do the trick in the final. Vamos Espana!
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Quote:
"Phil, you are forgetting a basic fact; football is two sides of 11 chasing a ball for 90 minutes and Germany WINS.
Something to do with concentration, physical endurance, confidence and a never say die attitude."
So Germanys concentration throughout the whole turkey match was spot on?
The centre backs could hardly play a 10 yard pass to one and other, they were there for the taking and if for not lahm taking a gamble on going foward, they may well not have made it to the final itself.
They've had the rub of the green too many times now and there luck has ran out. Spain have deserved there progress and deserve nothing less than eating the German defense for breakfast.
Even without Villa, Spain are gonna have a picnic.
Bon apetite!
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You cant rule the Germans out. I thought Portugal would turn them over and Ronaldo and co never got a sniff out the centre backs - even though they still conceded 2 goals. Spain will probably bring the best out of Germany and they wont be so dispy like the Turkey game.
Could go either way but like i said above, hopefully Spain go all the way and win it.
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Russia have a good game....Arshavin is the best player in Europe.
Spain win...Torres or Villa (or Fabregas) depending on who scores basically is the man to buy.
Germany get to the final with an average team and someone suggests Ballack is the player of the tournament and he gets shouted down. Makes me laugh. Who's had a better tournament? His team are struggling (because they're quite bad) to qualify and he spanks in a thirty yard free kick. Germany play the greatest team ever in Portugal (with Ronaldo possibly the best player ever to kick a ball) and Ballack controls the game (against Deco - no mean feat).
Seriously..who's had a better tournament?
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Podolski, Schweinsteiger have done just as much, if not more than Ballack to ensure Germany make the final.
Ballack has been decent but he is capable of so much more at times
and Deco was the best player in the quarter final.
Not having a go at ballack. But player of the tournement? No (Probably score a couple of Sunday now)
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and Portugal the greatest team ever?
LOL
They cant even defend set pieces
Ronaldo the greatest player to kick a ball?
get out of here
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Fabregas was brilliant because he played in a more forward role. Playing him in front of the back four is like driving a Maserati to the shops. If Villa is fit for the final, play him and put Fabregas on for Iniesta. His incisive passing will tear apart a lumbering and sloppy German defence.
And as for Arshavin.... Football is littered with 'late developer' players bursting on to the scene in an international tournament, playing their heart out for their country, securing a great deal with a big club, and....
...flopping badly.
He'll maybe get a game for Bolton.
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Iniesta plays right side though?
and Arshavin wasnt the only bad Russian player tonight. You cant call him a flop after one game
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I was being sarcastic about Portugal and Ronaldo....trying to repeat the media hype. I love Deco but I think Ballack had more of an impact on that game.
Thats your opinion about about Ballack for sure which is fine. If he hasn't been the player of the tournament though, who has? Easy to say who isn't, harder to say who is. Are podolski or schweinsteiger your players of the tournament?
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Fabergas is without doubt a better all round player than HYPED UP Ronaldo and if he played for Man Yoo the media would drown us with the fact that FAB is tremendous. Next season with Van persie, Kleb, Adebayor,and the likes Arsenal will win the title and probably the CHAMPIONS LEAGUE, if the officials play it fair Man Utd will struggle!
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Arshavin was a disapointment tonight though. Shame it never really kicked off for him and the Russians.
Still don't think you can compare 1 game to say Germany will do alright against Spain. Look at the whole tournament, Spain have looked sure, Germany haven't.
It a 1 off game and anyone can win but if Germany does then football wudn't be a cruel game, it would be sadistic.
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its hard to pick someone for player of the tournament. But players like Boric, wesley sneijder, pavlichenko, villa etc have proven they are/could be top players.
Ballack has been solid without being outstanding. Typical German really.
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Its not 1 game though, Germany are the ultimate tournament county and this team has provent that. They have got to the final of a major tournament by being fairly ordinary but hard to beat.
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The media made me hate Arshavin, and I am Russian.
Does anyone remember a certain Gary Breen following the 2002 world cup? Inter and Barca were after him. LOL.
Germany ordinary other than Ballack Phil? Lamn ordinary? Klose ordinary? Frings ordinary?
Perhaps you mean the team doesn't have much guile? But not having guile and being ordinary are not compattible.
Everyone talks about German efficency? Bullcrap.....they are probably the least efficent of all the big nations...Spain are an efficent team.
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Spain have been the most impressive team so far. Even the Italy game, they kept trying to play their football and win the game before pens. I feared for them when it went to pens but was so happy when they won.
Sunday will be a facinating game, especially if Spain score first. You seen tonight how well they play when they take the lead and the other team has to chase the game
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Not sure what all the fuss was about Andrei Arshavin. He has a couple of good games and reasonable season and suddenly he's the next Zizou.
As you say, one bad game doesn't make him a bad player either. What this game shows is he isn't world class. There's no shame in that, 'world class' is a title reserved for only a few.
Fabregas is the real deal though. Unlike Andrei Arshavin, he's produced the goods over several seasons and again at international level.
My fear for Andrei Arshavin is that he'll get signed by a huge club and fade back into mediocrity. He should stay where he is, and continue to win trophies for St. Petersburg.
What this reminds me of was the farce that lead Liverpool to buy Milan Baros, who was talked up as though he was the Czech answer to Ronaldinho. Ridiculous.
In fact you see this happen at every finals, whether it be the World Cup or the Euros.
Unlocking defenses at the top level of the Premiership, La Liga, etc is far more difficult than beating national sides that often have to settle on at least 2 or 3 players of mediocre quality.
Not even the Argentines, Brazil or Spain have world class players for every position. But a club like Manchester Utd, Arsenal or Barcelona could if they get it right in the transfer market or have a top class youth system.
So getting over enthusiastic because someone plays above his normal level for a season is a dangerous policy for managers. Martin O'Neal understands this, which is why he said it was unlikely he'd pay inflated prices for anyone that does well in Euro 2008.
Andrei Arshavin is 27. If he was world class, why haven't we seen him produce these performances in past seasons or previous competitions? My answer is his coaches. Advocaat and Hiddink are two of the best in the business, and have both shown again they can get the best out of a reasonable football team.
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good post ^^^^
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Good article although some people do not understand you and others that just talk nonsence. fabregas is a great player not just based on one or two preformances but for a few seasons at arsenal now. when hes been called upon for spain he has come on and created chances for the team and showed his class lets not forget he is only 21 any played aswell or even better than some of the players ahead of him in the spainish squad in the same position respectivly. arshavin i dont know much about but apparently he was the drivng force behind zenits st petersburgs success in there leauge... i can settle for that. cesc played a blinder tonight like he does for his club week in week out. and im sure arshavin is better than what he was tonight.
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Spain is pure madness tonight.
I thing the post is decently good.
Fabregas had a great game tonight and deserves to be hailed as the outstanding player that he is, but tonight it was a great team effort where players such as Xavi, Iniesta, Silva o Cesc himself reinvindicated a way of playing based on quality, inteligence, anticipation and balance. However, it is true that nobody better than Cesc Fabregas to personify a change of mentality not only in spanish football, but also in spanish sports, and even more in spanish society psyche, far away from the inferiority complex than spaniards have suffered for decades of a dictatorship and isolation.
I think it was the best game of spanish history, only equaled by a 9-0 display against Austria before the Euro2000, the only difference is that then it was home qualifiers game in march against a weak side at that time.
The other team I saw recently playing at that level in a tournament of this level, was Argentina against Serbia, 6-1.
I am truly happy tonight. The spanish TV leif motiv of "Podemos" (Yes we can, similar to the one of the american democrats) has become real.
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Fabregas gets too much praise, as if he'd have decided the outcome himself. Sorry, but that's not true.
It was a slick ball by Iniesta that gave Xavi the perfect scoring opportunity for the first goal. Xavi was incredible the whole first half, likewise Ramos. For the others, Fabregas may have made the assist, but one was again created by Iniesta.
Fabregas doesn't get into the fully fit Spanish first team because he is somewhat lagging behind Xavi and Iniesta. And don't start about Xabi Alonso who frankly, is nowhere near.
Xavi brings solidity in midfield and fluidity in passing while Iniesta can always come with wonderful balls, much more often than Fabregas could. In addition, Fabregas could never fill that wing spot. Iniesta while still somewhat struggling is doing a great job playing out of position I'd say.
Xavi and Iniesta are still one level above Fabregas, but Fabregas is an EPL player, an Arsenal gem and gets all the praise, when in reality, the whole Spanish team appart from one was deserving of such praise. And it was a team effort that won Spain the game all triggered by Xavi's goal simple.
Once Spain get the goal without having conceeded, they win games.
The one that is an exception to the "deserving of praise" rule is Torres who frankly, has been average all tournament. If Fabregas is to take part in a first eleven, provided Villa is fit, the team should be a 4-5-1 with Villa up front and Torres on the bench.
Torres's performances have been sub par for Spain for quite some time. Guiza would have been a better option than Torres today. But I don't see any mention of that. Maybe because Torres plays in the EPL too and he's so hyped up he can't do no wrong.
I think it's time to take off those EPL biased binoculars. In the end, Spain winning is what counts. Against Germany, it's 50-50. Germans will always be Germans.
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Xavi is a genious. and Iniesta isnt even a right mid but he is that good you can play him wide right and left.
Playing 1 up top might suit Spain against Germany. Torres has'nt been at his best but is still a threat, guess we will find out how serious villia's injury is tomorrow. After tonights performance if you be hard to leave Cesc on the bench. But you obviously cant drop Xavi or Inestia, meaning Torres or Villia (if fit) would have to be dropped........ guess thats what the manager is paid to do
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*it would
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Fabregas is working well as a high-impact substitute. There really isn't any need to change a winning formula.
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wat a pathetic argument.is alexofalexia for real?fabregas average,if he was al that he'd b startin.but 2 say torres has been astoundin is a joke.the biggest let down of the tournament..........torres
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btw how can u possibly compare fabregas with wat zidane's achieved over his career.fab wil never be the player zizou was
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ur prob arsenal fans but he's overrated!!!!!! outclassed by xavi n iniesta
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I HAVEN'T SEEN ANYBODY ANYWHERE ZIDANE'S LEAGUE IN THIS TOURNAMENT
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Germany do it time n time again.never bet against them.u all wish england played like them
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To be fair i think that Fabregas does deserve a bit of credit in as much as he has been a "high impact" substitute" and maybe it would be a good idea to the formula that has seen Spain reach the final. when he has come on he has looked quality and there is no denying it. to say that Xavi and Iniesta are a different class is nonsensical because i think we all know that all 3 of the above are extremely talented players capable of turning a game with one incisive pass or flick. it's no different than the Gerrard/Lampard debate which quite frankly is boring. Fabregas is quality and at the age of 2,1 to say he is never going to achieve what ZZ did in his career is unfair and short sighted. As with everyone trying o pick their player of the tournament. Wait until it's over before you make a judgment.
Also, while Torres hasn't bagged the goals this tournament he is still a valuable member in the side as he stretches defences and takes a lot of the attention from the central defenders. If Torres wasn't playing in their opening match then Villa would never have scored a hat trick. If he didn't make the runs he does (many of which are away from goal) then the space wouldn't open up in which the likes of Xavi, Iniesta and Fabregas to operate with such potency.
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Based on last nights performance, I am sure everyone is in agreement that Spain is very fragile and Germany, as is almost always the case, will become champions. I saw nothing last night that will give the Germans sleepless nights and Low will be very confident of victory. Spain should be proud for reaching the final.
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I still give Germany the favourites tag. They know how to win the big matches even if they don't play well. Just because Spain played well yesterday it doesn't mean that they will triumph eventually. Phil seems to be jumping to conclusions.
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Ha, ha, ha! Time to cover one's arse. After all the ludicrous, over-the-top hype about the new wunderkind Arshavin from the starry-eyed press corps - especially the deluded BBC contingent - the little twerp fell flat on his face last night against Spain. He didn't make the slightest difference in the much touted rematch between these two teams. Russia still lost again by three goals! "No one should doubt his ability on the strength of one poor showing"? Strength, what strength? Don't you mean weakness? But we - or at least you - should, presumably, believe he's "the real deal" on the basis of TWO games against Sweden and Holland. Brilliant! What use, pray tell, are overpaid, half-baked, football media pundits? So now, 'it's Spain for you on Sunday', is it? That's funny, six days ago you said, "with grim inevitability, I believe the real winners when the dust settles will be Germany". Given how spectacularly wrong you got it about Arshavin and Russia, you're new infatuation with Spain would seem to make it a pretty safe bet that Germany will be crowned champions on Sunday. But either way your arse is covered since you've now tipped both to win! And when it's all over, maybe you can call Everton and ask them if they still want Andrei what's-his-name?
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The best side in the tournament was Holland
------------------------------------------------
You are right it was Holland but it is now Spain :-)
Actually I was of the same opinion as you but the fact of the matter is who has got a better defence. Russia had a good defence but the way Puyol and company played yesterday would make any fan comfortable and confident. Holland although had the best attack they lacked in defence thus they had to go out. Besides I also think 7 8 days of rest did nto do them any favours and just broke their rythm.
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"I hope we saw the real Arshavin against Sweden and the Netherlands because he looked lightweight against Spain, but no-one should doubt his ability on the strength of one poor showing."
Maybe we shouldn't have hyped the player on the back of 2 good performances!
You have to ask yourself how a player at 27 has escaped the eyes of all major European scouting networks?
If he was that good I have a feeling someone might have pinched him by now.
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I think Cesc is not overwhelmed by fans, he is not such type of player who can`t do nothing after praises he keeps playing the ball because he loves it,and he never do mistake because he does n`t care about the comments, that is why he always comes no.2-3 or 1 in spanish team player`s rate as a substitute,and what about if he starts the game!for me Fabregas is the best midfield and supporting striker in the world.
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I thought Spain were tremendoud in both games against Russia but if I'm honest it's difficult to think of another game they've shone in.
Against Sweden they were very unconvincing but produced a decent enough workmanlike display (and I know how you hate THAT Phil) to win with pretty much the last kick of the game. the Greece game was a non-event, and against Italy - althought they were the better side - they never really looked like scoring and had the pace of the game entirely dictated to them by the World Champions.
I think they'll probably win the final and I kind of hope they do (as a Swansea City supporter I'm up for all things Spanish these days :)), but to say they definately deserve it over Germany? Can't say I really agree with you there. Sorry. (Germany have, after all, scored twice as many goals as them in the knockout stages so far...)
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I belive in Spain, for once as a spanish I am and was convinced of success. It has been the same feeling than following any European under16,17,18 21s championship. A spot in the final is the minumun to expect.
And now we have broken the bad feelings,.. our domination will be as strong as it is in indoor futbol 5.
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Fabregas will win the Euro with Spain and will win something next season with Arsenal. He is a good player (not of Zidane standard), with a good eye for the ball and positioning. Probably the best player in his midfield attacking position. And leaving Arsenal never does your career any good most times so he will not leave (take Henry; Lyunberg etc as eg's.)
Spain as a team in this tournament have proved to be the total package for the moment. Time to prove me right by winning (Winning twice against Russia by 3 goals says it all).
Germany on the other hand are a well oiled machine and I think that even if Ballack doesn't have a great day Sunday, the Germans as always in a final will be dangerous as they have that winning mentallity.
Euro2008 has been a great success and there have been some really great matches and lots of goals, with great teams emerging from no where and great teams going nowhere ( France for example ).
I hope that Spain win, even though I have no love for their coach (what he said about my fellow countryman Thierry Henry is unforgiveable).
Bring on Sunday.....
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After Villa went off, the Spanish did well because they kept on rotating Xavi, Iniesta and Fabregas; the Russians simply couldn't keep up with the changes.
Torres was also disappointing, but that could also have been to do with the fact that he always seemed to be cutting in from the left, rather than playing through the middle like he does at Liverpool.
Doesn't really excuse his miss of a simple tap in, but he'll hopefully come good for the final - didn't Shearer say that the only time you need to worry is when you're not getting any chances?
In fact it was only when Guzia came on that he was pushed through the middle (albeit a little bit from the right) and got results against the Russian right-back who was flagging by that point in the game, having been tormented by Sergio Ramos for most of the match.
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Torres was brilliant last night, he waould have scored if he had not been taken off, were some people on here watching a diffrent game! Fabregas and iniesta were sublime
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Firstly, It really bothers me that you would compare the excellent Spanish to the totally inept Portuguese? The Spanish are so far over their Iberian neighbours in critical departments such as in ball retention, forwards and goalkeepers that it is almost laughable, the spanish provided they perform and Fabregas is included to win ar a canter for me.
I would also like to come to the defence of the tournaments emergent star Arshavin. Multitudes of people have slated the Zenit playmaker for not influencing the game as he did in the Russians previous 2 outings. I find this extremely harsh for a few reasons. 1. while the match was competitive Senna was undoubtedly Spain's best player superby marshalling Arshavin and other Rusian threats. 2. Spains midfield axis simply owned the ball, how can any attacking player excel if those around him provide no platform for his obvious talents. While I accept people taking issue with an obvious reduction in his workrate to all of a sudden doubt his ability on the grandest stage is pharcical
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Calm down.
As good as Fabregas was, and as good - in other games - as Arshavin was, neither of them yet compare to Zidane.
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This article sums up why I feel a bit disappointed by the coverage of the Euros.
Pre game all we got was lots of coverage of the new darling of the media, the Russian lad, lots of it linked to the possibility of him playing in England and his performances against British teams. Even a quote of his about wanting to go to Spain was transformed into him wanting to go to Spain or England, before he had the interview with the beeb where he expressed respect for the Prem.
Now after the match despite the wonderful performances of Xavi, Ramos, Iniesta and a number of other Spanish players the coverage is devoted to those that play in the Premiership. Give us the truth rather than Premiership half truth/propaganda.
The reason Frabregas didn't start for Spain is that there are players who don't play in the Premiership who are actually better than those that do. I know that statement is totally unbelievable, but honestly it is point worthy of discussion. If the British media were capable of looking further than what is in England then perhaps there would not be the blind belief that England are one of the great teams.
When you look at Spain's midfield you really do have to laugh at the concept that Barca were desperate to get Lampard a year or two ago, as if he would get into their team. But the media promotes the insane concept that our players are the ones everyone wants.
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Every journalists best friend hind sight !! True Spain were brilliant last night but their previous game against Italy was awful !! The spanish mind set aginst Italy was please god dont lose whilst they were much more confident against a team they had already beaten although untill Villa went off it was even steven in terms of play . However once Fabregas came on the russians were chasing shadows and the Spanish team reminded me of the Dutch team of total football from the 70 s who won ??? thats right nothing !! It will be interesting to see if the Spanish mind set is right for a game against the worlds best team at winning ugly !
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Fabregas nowhere near as good as Iniesta or Xavi?
Fabregas has one good game for Spain and gets hyped up?
All nonsense.
Firstly, both Xavi and Iniesta had been distinctly average in the tournament till last night, there's a reason Fabregas keeps coming on to replace Xavi. I believe Spain are very lucky to have a dirth of very good midfielders and Senna has provided excellent muscle to back them up.
I don't see how people can say Fabregas is average, he's been consistently good this season, and at times unstoppable.
If Ronaldo does end up going to Madrid this summer I know who my money would be on for the PL.
Also, anyone think that there was something about Barcalona making a bid for Arshavin BEFORE the semi final, could this have been a ploy to try and unsettle the player before the game? Wouldn't put it past them you know!
For the final, Spain certainly deserve to win it, but lets not forget the Germans may not have played the best football, but they've scored just one less than Spain throughout the tournament, albeit in the much easier half of the draw. If Spain play as well as they can, then I honetly see their midfield tearing the shaky German defence to shreds. However, if they don't take their chances when they come along, they can expect to be punished.
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Is noone going to mention that the rock of the Spanish team and probably the most relentless play has come from SENNA...!!!
He gets none of the limelight... why?
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Fabregas brings in plenty of freshness.
May the team that provides excitement and thrill to the viewers take away the title on Sunday.
Best of luck to the two sides.
Dr. Cajetan Coelho
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Is not the structure of Euro2008 thoroughly flawed ?
1) Three of the four semifinalists had failed to beat their QFinal opponents (needing extra-time or the absurdity of penalties)
2) Three of the four semifinalists had already been beaten by teams which had by now been eliminated !
3) One semifinal was between two teams who had already played each other, so that we already knew which was the better. Why did they need to play again ? And if Russia had won, would the finalist have been decided by better goal difference in the two matches or should there have been a third deciding match.
All that is absurd. And arises from the ill-matched mixture of league and knock-out elements.
I've never "blogged" before and I understand my space is limited. I'll put the solutions to all this on a succeeding "blog"
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So Spain have been the best team in the tournament whist Germany have been 'workmanlike'? Have you actually been watching this tournament?
Fair enough Spain put in a good performance last night and in their opening game, but against Sweden and Italy, you would have to say that Spain were nothing more than workmanlike and certainly not entertaining to watch, while the Greece game was a non-event. So i dont think you can heap so much praise upon a team who have only performed against one team in the entire tournament, and this was against a side that were largely unfancied at the beginning of the tournament and achieved massively by simply passing the group stages.
You describe Germany as workmanlike, so i think it's quite an achievement for a workmanlike and 'average' team to have already scored ten goals in the tournament and knock a team out who were described by some as the best team in the tounament.
When the progress of both finalists so far is weighed up, you'd have to say that both sides have put in two good performances and two very average performances, so it is 50/50. But on the basis of Germany's ability to change tactics, get results when it really matters and their performance against Portugal i'm plumping for Germany to lift the trophy.
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I like the comparison between Arsenal and Spain on being great teams that cannot deliver the big prize. A very and true comparison I would say. Fabregas is brilliant but if he want to ever collect a big football prize for club or nation he better move to another club (ManU?) and maybe begin the naturalization process as a... German?
Germany will prevail on Sunday mainly because of Spain's own inferiority complex.
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Well played Cesc. Good luck to Spain in the final.
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I like the comparison between Arsenal and Spain on being great teams that cannot deliver the big prize. A very good and true comparison I would say. Fabregas is brilliant but if he wants to ever collect a big football prize for club or nation he better move to another club (... ManU?) and maybe begin the naturalization process as a... German?
Germany will prevail on Sunday because they are Germany and because of Spain's own inferiority complex.
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BigNevsTache you are an idiot!
If you knew anything about European football you would know that Arshavin's reputation isn't based on two good performances but is actually based on a season when he inspired Zenit to win the UEFA cup (beating Bayern Munich 4-0 on the way) and the Russian league, there was already serious talk of how good he was. His performances in these Euros have just confirmed how good a player he really is, turning Russia into one of the most attractive teams to watch in years.
He may not have performed well against Spain but anyone can have an off night, how often does Ronaldo fail to perform on the biggest stage and alot of people think he is the best player in the world.
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i would still bring fabregas as a substitute not from the start against the germans. in tournaments you always should have a hidden hand that you can play mid-play. Once he starts and is part of a losing formation he might never rise.
I hope Villa recovers and Spain starts with the same team that started against Russia.
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Now I understand why so many predictions go wrong. Because people as well as the pundits tend to bet on attacks while the infact it is strong defence that wins you tournaments. Spain has my vote in this regard and spain proved this last night. It was not a bad performance from Russian attack it was a splendid performance from spanish defence. remember the first half which was a battles of defence. Every ball was contested so closely and no creative player had room to operate. Mind you russia also have a solid defence that is why they were able to beat Holland. so at the end it was only a matter of who loses the focus first and Russia lost it after the first goal. which was a bit lucky as Xavi actually flicked straight at the keeper. after that Russian players were all over the place.
So I am tipping Spain to win as they can absorb the pressure that Ballack and co. can apply but have my doubts about German defence. nonetheless I agree with people who have mentioned the German attaitude. They do have an irritating nack of matching what the other team is doin on the feild. but still I feel its Spains year.
As for fabragas Arshavin and Zizzu debate. it is actually senseless.
Fabrgas is an amazing prospect and I wish he betters what Zizzu Pele and Maradona has done (What a story that would be). ut I would not put this weight on his shoulders right now. Let the kid be himself and do what he can.
Arshavin too soon to say anything right now.
On of the all time greats and IMO the most pleasing to watch ever.
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fabregas is 10000000 times better than Cristiano "moneybags" ronaldo
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Lets be honest here Arshavin is been hyped up because he scorred against the swedes( not 1 world class defender in that team) and then the Dutch ( only thing world class about their defence is van der sar). Barca are about to buy a 20 million flop that cant penetrate world class defences ie Puyol, sergio ramos.
Fabregas has just proved why he's going to be one of the best central midfilders that has ever lived (remember he's just 20)
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To answer Blog 66 :-
1) In a knock-out competition if there is a draw, let's have a replay the following day.
To anticipate some of the objections to this :-
a) Footballers are young men at the peak of physical fitness and should have no problem in playing two football matches on consecutive days. If however they are in fact weaker than I suppose, I'm sure there are plenty of volunteers of the same nationality more than ready to take their places.
b) Organisation/Security. Forget about tickets; let the spectators come in through the turnstile on a firstcome firstserved basis (that's how all matches used to be arranged with minimum problems). If the security forces cannot be mobilised in sufficient numbers and in sufficient time and/or if the spectators cannot be relied upon to behave themselves, then let the matches be played without spectators - most of the interest and revenue is in any case generated by TV, which is how the overwhelming majority of spectators see the competition.
2) Given the present flawed structure, and given that the quarterfinals involved the pairing of 1st and 2nd placed teams from each of two qualifying groups, surely it was not beyond the wit of man to see that the winners of each quarterfinal should be paired in the semifinal against a team emerging from one of the other two groups. Thus Spain should have been playing against Germany or Turkey - and same for Russia. After all, if Croatia had beaten Turkey in their QFinal, then both semifinals would have been repeat performances (Spain/Russia and Croatia/Germany)
3) But really the solution is to structure the competition (and same applies to WorldCup) EITHER as a league OR as a knock-out; and clearly knock-out is more appropriate.
As for the choice of the final 16 places, that too is a nonsense, with its tedious apparently never-ending series of "league" matches .
To take a familiar analogy of our own FA cup it's as if the teams qualifying for the fifth round were chosen from 15 leagues, each containing a mixture of teams from the Premiership, Leagues, Conference, Ryman and goodness knows where else, with the holders being given a bye to the 5th round.
Why can't international competitions be organised as pure knock-out even if (as with the FA cup) there is an element of seeding whereby the higher seeds enter the competition only in its later stages ? If, as I suspect, it's because financial considerations outweigh sporting ones, then there's no reason why national teams can't play each other anyway outside the competition itself.
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Phil your forgetting fabregas isnt even first choice for spain and Aragones is likely to go with guiza upfront with torres! As for Spain i fear as good as they have been to watch at times they've only impressed against average teams, which for all their plaudits russia are. When you put Spain up against the italians they were average at best, same will happen againts the Germans however the germans will have the cutting edge the italians didnt.
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Arshavin has not been on the big club's radar until now for two reasons. Russian clubs have only become a credible force in european club competitions in recent years, and previous Russian international teams have not been good enough to accomodate the free role that he adopts.
If he does want to move from Zenit this summer, I think there are a limited number of club teams that are strong enough to accomodate his style. If he moves to a mid table club, it's likely that he'll be a flop!
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what a game from spain yesterday i thought they were fantastic and fabregas pass was just sublime. shame bout david villa he will be out for the final, i relly like him bet he is gutted bout it. i think fabregas should be a definite starter for the final.
its hard to choose but im supporting spain to win the euros i jus love torres, villa fabregas puyol ramos and casillas. der all jus class players.
if germany lose you can bet ballack will be steaming.
he lost the champions league final, da world cup final he missed through suspension the budeliga title they lost on the last day and missed the treble and now missed the champions league with chelsea.
is there a plyer more unlucky than him please tell me if der is
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This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the House Rules.
Well,agreed spain may win,but they have to play very well against the German machine.Fabrigas is a good player no doubt about what he can do as you saw last night and he can surely inspire spain to victory on sunday but dont forget the magic power,skill of Ballack,bodoski and the white colour man "swersni".So its 50-50 match which will be decided by the final whistle.
YOMI SAMUEL,NIGERIA
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I think Ballack has been as good as anyone in the way he plays, ontop of that he is by far the best captain in the tournament and a great leader. If Germany win the tournament it would be hard not to give player of the tournament to Ballack unless Podolski got another couple of goals which would cause abit of doubt.
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i dont undrestand why suddenly people think that arshavin is a world class player and clubs like braca and chelsea are after him??? and for 20m ???? he has 2 good games at the top level and suddenly hes compared to zidane, arshavin is not some 19 year old hes 27 years old ( i think). not only you cant compare him with a legend like zidane, u cant even compare him to fabregas.
fabregas has been performing game after game for arsenal since he was 17
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Never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever write germany off...........ever
They could field a team of 3 legged donkeys and id still never bet against them.
In the past 12 years, they have had the worst side for possibly 40 years, yet they have still got to the world cup final, semi final and now to the european championship finals.
Persoanlly, whilst thinking spain are, man for man, a better team, i think germany will win. They will bully spain in much the same way they did portugal, and they certainly have the firepower to hurt spain.
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I can't disagree that Cesc played well, but I don't think that was the reason for Spain's sudden improvement in the macth.
For me, the reason for the turnaround and the emphatic nature of their 2nd half performance, was the change from a 4-4-2 to a 4-5-1/4-2-3-1 or whatever permutation you wish to use.
Torres suddenly looked a completely different player, midfielders were more driven to get into the box and suddenly Spain became more direct/urgent as opposed to the over-patient style when they have 2 up front.
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What a wonderful game I saw, thanks for David Villa his substitution makes Spain to wine, you know what I mean there is no player like Fabregas. He is really changing the spirit of the game and for me he was man of the game. Finally I would like to say some to their coach please make him to play full game he will never let you down.
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hold'em
F:C.Barcelona is a team from Catalunya or Catalonia (for you), region of north east of spain. some of them don't want to be spanish, they want to be independent. Joan Laporta (president of F.C.Barcelona) is one of them, he wants a national team for Catalunya. then i think barcelona wasn't trying to unsettle Arshavin helping Spanish team, for sure.
this is the frist time spain is playing like a champion does:
1.second match vs Sweden: in previous champs this match it should be 1-1 and this time we won.
2.trird match vs Greece: in previous champs this match it should be 0-1 for Greece and we won again.
3.fourth match vs Italy: we sould loose playing better than them like in world champ 2006 with france but this time we won.
why not on sunday vs germany?, let us try
players deserve. WE CAN JUST TRY.
this is a spanish from BENIDORM, has anyone of you been here?
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"no-one should doubt his ability on the strength of one poor showing"
And likewise he shouldn't have been rated so highly after 2 good performances, one against a very average Swedish team.
Fabregas has been one of Spain's top performers at Euro 2008, even as an impact player. Hats off to him.
I'll be interested to see whether he starts the final or is used from the bench...
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it depends on Villa, if he can play (i don't think so) Fabregas will be on the bench, if Villa is not playing fabregas will do.
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i cant believe we waste taxpayers money on the rubbish that you write
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i cant believe we waste taxpayers money on the rubbish that you write
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The irony.......
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fabregas is a frist class player, but i don't think he was who changed the match yesterday, iniesta and Xavi did that with the first goal and then fabregas did what he is able to do, but not him alone.
i think english are not fair with players out of the premier league, you seem you only like premier players, it's what seems form outside of england.
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cyberlancer wrote:
"Based on last nights performance, I am sure everyone is in agreement that Spain is very fragile and Germany, as is almost always the case, will become champions."
You must have accidentally tuned in to some channel without live transmission rights which sent some recording of a ten year old game.
This was the best game I've seen so far. Several commentators (including Aragones) seem to think that Spain were struggling in the first half. I can't agree - although there was more of a balance Spain still had the edge. In the second half they just blew the Russians away. Fabregas was good, and seems equally fluent whether he's playing for Arsenal or Spain (similar footballing philosophies perhaps?) But for me, man of the match was Sergio Ramos, who was tireless, always in position to dismantle Russian attacks down the left flank with cool and ruthless effectiveness, making not a single defensive error, yet as soon as Spain had possession making himself available to support and create attacking moves deep in the Russian half, almost as effective in offense as in defense. All in all the Spanish defense is awesome, and that's where the real credit should be placed, because a defense like that makes life a lot easier for a creative midfield player like Fabregas or Iniesta. Pavlyuchencko was seen a couple of times, and Arshavin hardly at all; this doesn't necessarily make Arshavin ridiculously overhyped (although he probably has been), it is more a testimony to the anything but fragile quality of Spanish football.
On the other hand Germany's fragility at the back was exposed repeatedly by both Croatia and Turkey, and could also be seen in the Poland game, although the Poles failed to capitalise on it. Only in the game against Portugal have Germany shown any class and even so it didn't match the class we saw last night.
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Yet another world class performance from Fabregas, Ronaldo goes missing against the best teams Fabregas shines against them, and destroys them.
With regard to the comment about wenger not winning anything, well as a life long Arsenal fan I could not care less if we never won another cup under Wenger, because Football is a spectator sport it is a form of entertainment and quite frankly us Arsenal fans get to watch THE best football every week and the best entertainment in europe that is why the emirates is rammed to the rafters every game, despite the highest ticket prices.
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Fabregas Fever is just a little annoying.
The dominant Spanish midfield performance of the tournament so far came from Xabi Alonso in Spain's win over Greece.
He bossed the game from start to finish, setting the tempo, hitting the bar and nearly scoring from the halfway line. It was a midfield masterclass.
Yet still the TV commentators banged on about Fabregas.
When he came on last night he slotted straight into the pace of the game and displayed his full range of passing yet warranted barely a mention.
He must be used to that by now.
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Hope Germany win and I don't care if they play boring football. They simply need to be as efficient as they have been. The Spanish will choke again as usual. That said I'm not very interested in Euro 2008 anymore and bring on 2010 and hopefully we will do better than in 2006!
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I've only read the first 40 odd comments but no mention of Carlos Puyol?
I thought he's been immense for spain this tournament esp. against Italy and Ramos as well has impressed me. Obviously we look at the goal scorers and creators, but I think the two defensive players have got better as the competition has gone on. I can't say the same abotu any of the german back four.
Ballack has impressed me but not for every game. Can't believe he's 6ft 3 and still looks shorter than his teammates!!
So I'm backing spain simply because they still have the 100% unbeaten record, plus it will make great 'pub chat' when I go and see the inlaws and co in spain this summer :-)
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Can't understand why so many people are knocking McNulty.
He writes - correctly - that Fabregas had a great game. He writes - correctly - that Spain are a wonderfully talented team who deserve to be in, and win, the final. And he writes - correctly - that Arshavin had a stinker. Yet people are tying themselves in knots trying to pick holes in what he says.
I hold no special torch for McNulty. But you've got to remember the guy is on a hiding to nothing. He couldn't write that 2+2=4 without some opinionated idiot writing in to argue the toss.
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I believe that Fabregas is arguably the best distributor of the ball in the game today. If he is not, he soon shall be. Vision in distribution unequivocally improves with maturity. Indeed, Bergkamp, Maradona, Zidane, Valderrama . . . all vastly improved their passing with age. The fact that Fabregas already distributes the ball so magnificently at 21 is astounding. He may lack the ability to play down the wings, but then putting him out on the periphery is a waste of his vision. He is a field general, and if he is not now, he soon will be recognised as the best passer in the game. (To be mentioned in the same breath as Zidane, he needs to add about 50 pounds of muscle, put in a whole lot of magesterial -- and winning -- performances, and improve his shooting, as he did early in the season only to fade in the latter months of the Premiership.)
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Xabi Alonso midfield masterclass of the tournament? Admittedly he played well that nyt, but still worst comment ever
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He plays in the Premiership, so he must be Spain's best player.
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Come on Phil - this article is based at Arsenal fans.
He might not even be playing in the final. I know we want some Brtish interest but were not that desperate.
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For the record, people are not proclaiming Arshavin a genius just because of two games against Sweden and Spain. Not only was he crucial in helping Russia beat England to the Euros, but he was utterly inspired throughout Zenit St Petersburg's UEFA Cup triumph. Zenit hammered Bayer Leverkusen 5-1 in Germany and Bayern Munich 4-0 at home, playing gorgeous football, and Arshavin was directly responsible for both goals in the final against Rangers.
Arshavin has had a fantastic season, winning the league and UEFA Cup and when he came back from suspension he showed himself capable of performing on the international big stage.
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whoa,hold your horses Phil-don´t get me,wrong Fab is fab.However while Villa was on the park Iniesta couldn´t do a thing right.Villa duffs his foot while taking the free-kick,Fab comes in and all of a sudden Iniesta couldn´t put a foot wrong and was just as big a part of the trouncing as Fab.Khirkov didn´t get a look in because the brilliant Ramos took him out completely!Senna played a huge part in keeping Arshavin out while Puyol and Marchena kept Pavluychenko at bay.All the Spanish players had an excellent game and let´s hope they can compete against Germany in the final.
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only1asprilla - who are you to say what The Arsenal will win and what they wont - do you have a crystal ball to hand.
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Fabregas truly deserves all the praise he's getting tonight. Watching him against Russia was reminiscent of Zidane controlling games at the highest level but without the arrogant, 'I don't need to be here' attitude
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zidane arrogant. ok this is the first i have heard of it. fabreags is no where near zidanes level yet (and nver will be). and if fabregas does not have an attitude then no-one does. what a sad gooner you are alex. with villla injured fabregas will play in the final but frings, ballack and borowski will be a bridge too far for him.
arshavin is a good player (and over the last 2 games was the best player in the tournament but not after the spain game) but not WORLD class. he definitely ahs the talent but maybe lackedconsistency or mental strength. something that will win germany the tournament on sunday
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rsootarsing,
I think Barcelona may have something to say about the most entertaining football in Europe with the exception of last year and indeed Spain based on this Championship.
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I believe that Fabregas is arguably the best distributor of the ball in the game today
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another typical gooner. he will start well and then fade when the going goes tough. prilo, sneijder, ballack, ronaldo and ribery al rank above him not to mention xavi and iniesta. fabregas is rated better because he is a prem player, no other reason. you do not want to listen to a clown like mcnulty.
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An excellent article. Agree with analogy with Fabregas playing for Arsenal and Spain. Great player, insightful, great engine, inspirational.
All round, Spain have been excellent. A previous member wrote that Puyol had been excellent, but I think the Spanish defence has generally been very solid. Sergio Ramos had a very good game against Russia.
The first semi-final had my heart hoping for Turkey (being heavy underdogs), but head saying Germany (efficient).
Second semi-final, I did not care, as both teams were in form, and produced attack minded, free-flowing football. Very disappointed with Russia's general non-appearance.
This time, head and heart both want Spain. Yes, they have this mental fragility, but I think their use of younger players, and Aragones' decision to pass on Raul and Guti will bear fruit come Sunday.
But....it's a funny old game. My money had been on Croatia. Oh well...
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maldiniforzamilano,
In all fairness, Fabregas did shine vs Russia whereas Ronaldo did not dominate vs Germany, Ballack had no discernible impact vs Turkey, Ribery did not even do a great deal in the group stage.
Not sure about the others though.
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Spot on Phil, Fabregas has looked quality this tournament. If we are honest and look at raw stats he has outperformed the spanish starting midfield quartet comfortably.
Personally i am 100% in support of spain. They are unbeaten, have scored a few goals, played some quality passionate and technically excellent football and their movement up front has been sublime.
With Villa fit i would have backed the movement of Villa and Torres to net 3 or 4 against the immobile and uninspiring german defence. With Villa out and Fabregas in i feel they lose a smidge of that movement but i think will be too much to handle still and should win!
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maldinietc., the 'typical gooner' epithet is misplaced, and is based solely upon my admiration for Fabregas' passing ability, which you've done nothing to diminish.
Your list of players who rank above him is puzzling: do you mean overall, in which case you have a colourable argument, or in passing, in which case you're having a laugh?
Pirlo is better at set pieces, but is otherwise vastly overrated in my opinion; sneijder is a much better striker/scorer but not a distinguished distributor, especially compared with Fabregas; ballack is an attacking midfielder, not a distributor of the ball. He's a brute force with a great shot and a great head, not an artist. Ronaldo may be the world's best, but he is also the biggest ball hog in the world, now, and anything but a distributor, most of the time. If your first thought is to shoot, and not pass, you are not to be compared with a true distributor, like Fabregas. Ribery has a total game, more than Fabregas right now, and can run his butt off, dazzle with his runs, and widen the play, as well as shoot, but he is not a field marshall. As one pundit put it, he was 'Zidane's runner'; he was not the distributor. As for Xavi and Iniesta, the former isn't remotely in the same league in passing (or otherwise, I would argue), and the latter is a completely different player, a winger in essence. His distribution from the wing is excellent, but he is not a maestro distributor a la Fabregas. I'll let Phil defend himself, but, um, he's not the source of my analysis!
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Haha!!
Funny enough I told the Barca, ManU, and Real Madrid fans in the viewing centre yesterday when Cesc was being introduced, "here comes the best midfielder in this tournament", 99M for offer and the game of highest bidder. They all snapped. After the brillant flashes, some felt it was a fluke. Assisted second goal with a deft touch, I raised my voice 149M offer. Third goal secured by the help of Cesc offer gone to 199M.
He is the very brillant chap to kill any opponent. Tested and confirmed. I give the tournament to Spain and Fabregas will captain Arsenal if Wenger still the coach in another season to come
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The media are so desparate for one player to be the focus of everything. First Ronaldo and Snijder. Teams go out so we move onto Arshavin. Now Russia are out it's Fabregas.
The reason Spain have got so far is not through the brilliance of any one player but because they are the only team with world class players all over the park and who function as a team.
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Why so much vitriol on this thread directed at Phil McNulty for seems to be an entirely sensible article> I watched the match and the highlights last night, and Fabregas was indeed superb, playing a part in the build-up to just about all of Spain's scoring chances after he came on. Had Torres had a better shooting night Cesc could have had four or five assists.
Arshavin was practical non-existant and a huge disappointment, as were most of the Russian team - the possession was apparently 65%-355 in Spain's favour.
And the article biased against Arsenal? All he did was point out that after much promise they ended the season winning nothing. Does anyone dispute the accuracy of that statement.
For all the McNulty haters, just remember he's writing a blog on the Euros for the BBC that's read by thousands of people, and we're all sat at home or the office, tapping in our little comments.
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For those Fabergas haters....
He did NOT just have one great performance.
He had 3 VERY GOOD performance in each of the 3 group games, 1 AVERAGE performance in the quarters (well, the entire spain team was average), and his BEST performance of the tournament thus far in the Semi's
Those of us who support him are not jumping on the bandwagon just because of his performance tonight, but rather how he has been adding a little bit of extra quality and creativity for spain from the middle each time he's come on.
Please give credit where it's due, and Phil has done so. Why not you?
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We deserve it and we will win it. Why?
1. We beat the European Champioship
2. We beat the World Champions
3. We have won all our matches so far
4. We scored more goals than all the other teams
5. We have conceeded less goals than all the other teams
6. We have played better than Germany
7. We have people who know what it means to win Major Tournaments
8. We have Senna. We have Fabregas, We have Puyol and We have Casillas
And Finally like Russia with Hiddink, They have Micheal Ballack.
I am not even losing sleep about this game
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I posted a couple of days ago that Fabregas was the best midfielder in the tournament, that Russia were overrated inclusing the new 27 year old who is suddenly "the best midfielder in the world" etc. I said that spain would turn them over and that they would beat Germany in the final. I stick to that. Torres looks a little bit jaded to me but he is due a goal, as is David Silva.
People just go overboard on stuff. People who are now saying that this was a Spanish "masterclass" are as daft as the Russiand fans. Spain did enough, it was a poor game for most of the 90 minutes but Russia performed as I though they would. It's not sour grapes-they shouldn't have been there and England have only themselves to blame for that.
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Barca 4 ever
I agree. I would love to see Spain win it and it's not an anti-German thing. The Germans just know how to win-that's the danger for Spain, they always do just enough (the Germans that is). They didn't deserve the win against Turkey but do they care? Spain have not fluked one game-they have been the best side in every one. Some more than others but people forget that it's a lot of games in a few days to get to the final. They can't play champagne football in every one.
The only doubts I have had is that the Torres/Villa combination doesn't look quite right yet but that's sorted now. Fingers crossed for your boys.
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People who post anti-Fabregas stuff don't deserve a reply. They are as stupid as the "Gerrard is crap' bozos. He is a class player and a class young man-good combination.
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though every body is free to support who ever he like the spanish team ply a beautiful foot ball but i felt german will nike this one due to their never say die atitude we are only spaculating come sunday after 90 menute the wenner will emarged..........
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Arshavin's praise shouldn't be based purely on this tournament, he has consistently delivered in the UEFA cup this season and does look like a genuinely class player just not at the same level as Fabregas and Ballack, these are two of the very best players in the world, Ballack is one of the best players Germany has seen and Fabregas has the potential to be Spain's greatest. The measure of a great player is surely to be able to drag their team through a rough patch or give them inspiration when there is nothing on. Ballack and Fabregas have both done this in the Euros especially Ballack. Ronaldo just didn't seem to get it right, i don't see why he is considered a better player than these two, he is on the same level but not above them. Silva, Torres, Podolski and Schweinsteiger have also had outstanding tournaments and deserve a mentionl.
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He still wont start the match!
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oh and whoever said Xavi has vastly inferior passing to Fabregas, i think they need to watch Barca, Fabregas will be a more complete player one day but Xavi is still the maestro for pulling the strings.
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re cesc........
I think this lot a baised towards people who paly in the pemiership. Incredibly, for the alleged best league in the world, of the starting line ups in both semis, just 3 by my count, play in the premiership.
3
cesc is good, but I will keep saying this, he isnt as good as iniesta or xavi. God, cesc and inesta played at barca youth level together......only one made the first team.
Hes a good player but he isnt spains best, not is he the difference. For me, senna is spains main man, a magnificent player who links the entire team together. Without him that backline would be pounded and their creative midfielders wouldnt see the ball.
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What a knee-jerk reaction to a substitute performance against a team that were already drifting towards elimination by the time he got on the field.
Torres has been criminally under-used by Aragones and so it looked like he 'came alive' due to the presence of Fabregas whereas the real reason was that he then became the sole target once Villa went off.
I think Spain have been very plucky in this tournament to date and Fabregas is seen as the leader of the pack by the English press who can't get their head around the fact that he isn't as good as Iniesta. Silva and Xavi are nice players but I wouldn't put either in a World's Best squad of 22 but both are preferred to Fabregas.
To put it simply, Spain are winning games because Villa and Torres make it impossible for teams to commit defenders forward, and because Casillas breeds confidence in a defence that only has one class performer in Sergio Ramos.
Spain's most impressive performance to date was the initial 4-1 drubbing of the Russians minus Arshavin. The Russians played well in that game and could have score more themselves whereas the Spanish broke and scored goals with ease.
Following that, they needed a last-minute goal to beat a poor Sweden side, they beat a terrible Greece side 2-1 after trailing, they couldn't threaten a Pirlo-less and Gattuso-less Italy in the QF, and the Russians that played yesterday reminded people of the side that lost 2-1 to Israel and who sneaked a 1-0 win vs Andorra in qualifying.
Let's face it, the Germans in the final will be the first big test for them in this tournament.
As for Fabregas being something of an extra-terrestrial, I wish people would leave him alone. If the media continually build up this facade of brilliance then he will never reach the heights that they demand of him. If he is left to get on with his game then maybe he can prove things himself, in his own time. Villa's beautiful lobbed pass which resulted in the saved shot that bounced nicely for Fabregas to tap in from half a yard was brilliance. Cazorla's inch perfect through ball for Villa's third goal vs Russia was brilliance but neithe of these moments are mentioned.
Ballack will show Fabregas the meaning of leadership, determination and talent in a high-pressure situation.
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Gentlemen, do me a favor and simmer down. Neither Fabregas nor Spain is beating Germany anytime soon. There isn't much of a difference between Spain and Portugal when it comes to their technical ability (except that Spain have the best goalie in the world in Casillas).
We should ask ourselves this question. When does Germany play its best footbal? They do it against big teams. They love the challenge and they elevate their game when it matters, just ask England and Holland for historical facts. Sad for them but great for Germany. One more fact people, this will be Germany's sixth, yes sixth, appearance in the Euro finals. For those of you who are still doubting their ability to win on the big stage, how about seven Worl Cup finals?
That's right, don't mess with Germans because they beat you like grown men.
Let's wn the fourth Euro, shall we?
Cheers!
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Mister McNumpty, did you watch the quarter-final against Italy?
If confronted with a good defense (also u may laugh at german defense just like some were laughing at italian defense after the groupstage game against netherlands), there is nothing left of the spirit of Spain.
120 mins of boring 0-0.
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Much as I would love to see Spain lift the cup from my sofa here in Barcelona on Sunday evening, we just know Germany are going to scrape a win. Without doubt. Sorry.
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Actually to all of those defending italian defense and how vulnerable spain is at defense:
- Spain is and has been the best defense at the tournament.
Why?
-That's something you may not used to hear, but the best way to defend is keeping the ball's possession.
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No one should doubt his ability on the strength of one poor showing eh? How about no one should laud his ability on the strength of one GOOD showing? All this talk of Arshavin was absurd. Yes, he's a good player, but there are plenty of those in the tournament.
Surely amongst the cream of this 2008 crop is Andres Iniesta, who once again seems to have escaped most plaudits' narrow gazes. He was instrumental once more last night. He always is.
Unlike Arshavin.
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I do agree with Phil about Spain being a worthy winner. Let's hope to have the same kind of entertainment in the final that we had so far (I do think that this is the best international tournament since a big while).
People were talking about Villa or Arshavin to be the MVP of the tournament. Don't throw Fabregas name out of the frame. He is the best impact player by far and should be considered. Each time he entered the pitch, he played brillantly and with a excellent spirit (he got the best out of sapnish and british styles). And the fact that he starts from the bench is only Aragones 's choice.
So my vote for Spain and for Fabregas for MVP trophy
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Granted, Ballack, a big physical presence and a motivator is important to Germany. However, the author tends to overlook the contribution of Germany´s little Jack Russell Terrier - Philip Lahm. He is their best player at the moment, even if he was repsonsible for Turkey´s second goal.
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Fabregas: I think he is on the subs bench because the system Arragonas has chosen requires Iniesta out right, a position he is not totally comfortable with but one Fabregas definitely can't play. The Iniesta/Xavi/Fabregas debate is long-running. Probably the only reason Arsenal got Fabregas was that both Xavi and Iniesta were blocking his route to the first team at Barca, mostly I think because they are 2/3 years older. Now I am not so sure. It is probably Iniesta rather than Xavi who is blocking Fabregas at international level but Fabregas may well be a better attacking player now. Both however are masters of vision and, especially, space and both are deadly at 15/20 yard pass.
Player of Tournament: Probably go with Ballack. As others have noted he is the fulcrum of the German side and has stepped up when required. But as an outsider I wonder about Senna? Spain's defence has looked very good and that might be a hint to the effectiveness of the holding player. Likewise the attack has played with freedom and that might be a hint to the effectiveness of the holding player. You see where I am going with this? He's not flash and he's not very obvious but i think he is very good. Just to note that as a Chelsea man we haven't won the league for two years because Makele has got a little too old! Players like that are so important
Final: Money is on Germany. Not because they are German and always blah blah blah. They are the most powerful team in the competition, have enough good players in Frings, Ballack, Podolski etc to cause trouble, have pace everywhere but centre back and have scored goals from open play with both feet and head, and both directly and indirectly from free kicks. Perhaps the Ballack/Senna dual will decide both the outcome and player of the tournament?
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I think Fabregas is a brilliant player but this article is typical of the Euro 2008 coverage. There is a massive bias towards English based players.
Spain are lucky to have wonderful midfield players, and they cant all play. Having watched Barca play most weeks for the last few years I would say Xavi is the best central midfielder in Europe, with Iniesta not far behind. That means Fabregas, good as he is, will struggle to start.
Senna, due to his type of play, has to start. Xavi, as the best, has to start, which leaves Silva, Fabregas and Iniesta.
Iniesta and Fabregas would be too narrow, so Silva has to play to give width. That leaves a straight choice between Fabregas and Iniesta.
Why is beyond some (and I stress the word some) English people that a player from La Liga can be better than a Premier League player?
To whoever said that Xavis passing isnt in the same league as Fabregas - that is either ignorance, arrogance or just stupidity. You also suggested Iniesta is more of a winger, which is just plain wrong.
Xavi in particular has wonderful vison, brilliant technique and awareness, and to me is the best passer of the ball anywhere.
Some people take that as an insult to Fabregas which is absurd. Being just behind Xavi and Iniesta is hardly an insult.
Everytime Fabregas has come on he has done really well, but English commentators claim that "he changed the game" etc.
Last night when Guiza scored, the commentators claimed that England based Torres had "softened up the defence for Guiza", so it wasnt Guizas goal really.
The worst thing was the way they seemed to revel in Villas injury as that meant Fabregas would start. It is beyond a joke.
The attitude was "who cares about the tournaments best striker missing the biggest game of his life, it means another English based player will start"
What everyone needs to remember is not to judge a player based on a major tournament. Zidane in 96 anyone? Poborsky?
People rave about Arshavin because he has been playing brilliantly for a long period of time, for a good team in a good league.
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to me Senna has been the most important spanish player. he's the reason why the other spanish midfielders can attack. he's not spectacular, but he cleans up all the loose balls in the midfield so that the others can shine.
i'm a germany fan, but my money is on spain. the german defense is not very well equipped to deal with quick players that make short passes on the ground. though i'm hoping that germany can get some of their trademark header goals as the spanish are quite weak in the air.
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torres for me has been quite bad. though i think it's mostly because his style of play is not typical for a spaniard. he's much more of an english or german player, excelling when he has space and gets fast, long balls in the attacking third of the field. the spanish hold the ball too much for him to be effective and he himself is not so good at the small passes.
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Beathyolow92...
Superbly well said mate. Iniesta is better than fabregas. No question. For me hes the most under rated player on earth. He managed to force his way into a barca team that has more atatcking talent than anyone other team in the world. That alone shows you how good he is
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In response to yellows99, I think you may be missing my point. At no point (unless I'm mistaken and you can draw my attention to the wording i used) did i state that Arshavin is a bad player. On the contrary, I really like him. i think he's class. I'm also well aware of why Arshavin is considered a quality player. I know it's not based on the two games in this tournament. Maybe it didn't come across but my gripe was with weak, reactionary journalism that declares the quality of a player right after he's just had an outstanding game. I don't recall everyone declaring that Arshavin was going to be player of the tournament BEFORE the tournament despite everybody (apparently) knowing what a class player he was at that stage. It's incredibly easy (as i did mention already) to stats that a player is good right after he's had a really good game.
My argument in a nutshell is that Arshavin plays 2 good games (as I stated in my earlier post - the one that made you call me an idiot) and then 'expert' journalists decide that it's safe to say he's a good player. It's really weak writing. Everyone can be an expert after the event. That's not what the role of the journalist should be and this is precisely why articles such as this annoy me. I did not say that Arshavin has only played 2 good games in his life and this is why everybody rates him. Do you understand now....idiot.
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..it was a poor game for most of the 90 minutes ...
**************************
If this was a poor game then strike me dead - the rest of the tournament can then only be described as absolutely atrocious. Still, if your idea of a good game is classic English football with lots of sliding tackles and physical contact and banging the ball optimistically up the field without any real strategy and making your strikers run like mad after loose balls, their only real hope being a defensive error on the part of the opposition, then I suppose you might feel something was missing. Otherwise it's difficult to see where there was much room for improvement in the Spanish midfield or defense - perhaps being a little sharper in the box would have produced five goals instead of three. Under any criteria a 3 - 0 win over a strong, ascendant and cleverly managed Russian side is an excellent feat. The Spaniards achieved it through rock solid defending, (but definitely NOT through playing defensive football ) a very creative use of free space, sublime passing and running combinations, technical finesse and high quality ball control; generally a fast, fluid and concentrated football which the Russians just couldn't keep pace with, and which was pure joy to watch. Had it been England playing this way ( if only they could! ) the press and every blogger on every uk site would be delirious, calling it the game of the century and there would be no end to the accolades. I doubt there would be a single dissenter calling it a poor game. Sadly, I have to acknowledge that England have never (or at least in the forty years football I have seen) produced football of this caliber, and presently show no sign of any potential to do so within the next five years.
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Oh and Panurge, what you say is fair but the reason people (especially me - I know) are knocking McNulty is not because what he writes is wrong, it's because it's so obvious. It's almost like he has 2 minutes to write up an article so he creates the safest, blandest column ever. If before the Spain game he'd suggested that maybe Fabregas is deserving of a place in a more advanced role for Spain than he plays for Arsenal then that would be insightful, intuitive journalism.
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I cant believe how harsh the english press has been on arshavin, the itv commentator actually said that after the build-up it was the worst performance he has ever seen. firstly you shouldn't label someone as the next zidane after 2 games and secondly, spain player really well, senna was on his ass all the time and they have plenty of experience, sometimes double marking him. Plus the pressure for someone who is not used to it.
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Fabregas is no Zidane. Not even close. It is unfair to compare him to Zindane and he probably would not appreciate that comparison. No doubt he will turn into a good midfielder, but I don't think that he will be able to constantly amaze his own team mates with his ability. Zidane was somehing else..
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Hello I am from Barcelona . I have read different posts from this blog and they all seem to mention francesc fabregas. Cesc is a world class player no doubt. He´s for me better as a distributor than xavi. But xavi is more efficient to control the ball possession than him. I don´t know how many of you have seen all the spanish games but if you have seen them you will notice that Fabregas has been ok but Marcos Senna has been simply a beast. Marcos Senna deserves all the praise for the way he´s playing he reminds me of the best makelele when he was playing for real madrid. And as for silva I don´t know if you see how this guy keeps the ball he´s better than arshavin just not as overhyped. Silva has produced in every game he´s an excellent player. I think spain finally has a new generation of world class players and this is just the beggining. Spain is going to win this tittle simply because it´s the best team there is right now in europe.
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What i find quite remarkable about this article and some of the comments is really the way in which one good games changes everything. Fabregas is a good young player and the operative word being young. He suits that system playing just off the striker but if he played in the place of xavi then you would see why xavi is picked. Both Xavi and inestia have detractors as they both play a role that really isn't that glamorous in a team, they have license to get forward but neither is exactly a huge goalscorer (xavi though did score the important goal last night people seem to have forgotten here) it's their overall contribution to a team that is the reason to choose them and it's not as if fabregas is a pensioner his time will come. HE is a talented player but i can't help but feel if he didn't play in the premiership we wouldn't have heard about this great performance last night half as much and torres or someone would have got the credit as is usual with the commentators and pundits in these tournaments. Yes you should reflect and try to communicate in familiar territory but after you have mentioned torres plays for liverpool once then thats enough thank you. I really don't care who players play for during a tournament as for most we know and the ones we don't will never be people we really care about or can't do a little research on without mentioning the fact that chelsea might buy them this has no relevance and is insulting to every other country in the u.k. Like the capello interviews there was no question to him asking about how the italians might do nor were there any plans to interview burley, worthington or toshack and this again is just a real annoyance over what has actually been an excellent tournament.
Just for the record to the statements about the germans being poor really don't mean much, they deserved to beat portugal and lets be honest even though they played badly they hardly went through 1-0 they scored three times and the third being right at the death never ever write them off!!! As for being an ordinary side two finals and a semi of major tournaments in six years i bet you wish england were that ordinary!!!!! It's just petty jealousy from english hacks to suggest they are ordinary, lahm and the midfield while not flair driven are still effective one of two centre backs has hardly kicked a ball all season so it isn't really a fair judgement on his progression as a player since the last world cup. I don't think they are a wonderful side by any means but this same core have done well at two tournaments it's not luck they have they knocked out one of the favourites and people forget that against croatia they had the run of the play before olic's extremely fortunate second goal they might just have a little too much power for the spanish i feel but a lot depends on the fitness of frings though if he doesn't make it i would have thought they might be brave and put borowski in the middle of the field but i suppose that doesn't afford the balance of frings ballack anyway will leave that there may the best team win!
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What really strikes me about the Spanish is their incredible ability to keep the ball when ahead in games. If we've got it - so the old saying goes - then they can't score. If only English national teams had that kind of technique. Scholes is the only English player I can think of with anything like that ability. And they let him retire when Lumpard popped up... Duh!
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Name me one central midfielder who has played as good or better than cesc fabregas at the highest level (EPL, Champions League, Euros) at the age of 21. answer no one. the whole world knows how good cesc is he might not be as good as zidane or gerrard or kaka, but none of them were as good as him when they were 21 years old. Central midfield is the hardest job on the pitch becasue central midfielders take control of the game, spains 1st game with russia cesc was great with a goal and assist and his work rate was also great. against Italy when cesc came on he played better than xavi and iniesta when they were playing. and in the semi final he was again better than them.
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Well Phil you talked up Arshavin and he flopped -now you are talking up Spain...
In fairness Spain played well yesterday but Russia never really showed up.
The game was tailor made for Fabregas with the room he had- as Russia opened up to try and chase the game.
Fabregas was not as effective against Italy though.
You dismiss Germany and in particular other star performers like Lahm, Podolski, Schweinsteiger, Klose who have all performed better in this tournament than Ballack. Have you actually watched any of Germany's games?
You also follow the usual media party like-Germany are lucky and undeserving champions if they win. How so?
Because they are not as pretty on the ball as Spain?
What exactly counts as "deserving" in the football world?
Both teams deserve to be in the final and the winner deserves to be champions.Simple as.
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Jabz316 post number 147-the answer is Bernd Schuster!
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jabz your comment is a bit silly. Fabregas came on late in the first game it wasn't exactly as if he came on and broke them down last night he did well but in this tournament spain without him have been better than usual in a tournament so obviously it has worked. Fabregas has played at the highest level and was better than zidane well zidane won the european cup with marseille did he not and was young and your reasoning that no-one has been better than him at 21 is just wrong fabregas has been playing since he was 18 so in terms of games he has probably played a lot but in a transitional arsenal side this isn't surprising but he has never been that amazing over a whole season or when it matters really. The thing is this shows a lack of understanding of players.
Some players have early peaks rooney is a perfect example of this he hasn't really got any better over the last couple of seasons and may not improve as a player ditto with fabregas lots of factors come into play and sometimes players progress naturally such as gareth barry who have got better with age. It's why this whole playing average english players instead of talented foreigners is incredibly short sighted, some players learn from playing games more than having natural ability and if you get both tied together you get a zidane who no offence to fabregas but is a completely different class of a player one who is the greatest player i have ever actually seen.
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sorry uefa final with cannes got confused there :O
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euanisakumbi regarding ur comments theres no way im saying that fabregas is better than zidane, but what im saying zidane at the age of 21 was not that good as cesc or well known, and he did not win uefa cup mate check it up. my point was that cesc is playing better than xavi and iniesta and at the age of 21 he is doing really well than anyone else did as a central midfielder he has been playing at the age of 18 and got alot of games under his belt that is my point because he is that good, he has been playing for a top champions league team, he has played in the world cup, champions league final, now he is going to be playing in euro final. so they way things are going in few years time he would probably be the only player that comes close to zidane in that position.
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pprozac, I very much appreciate your comment! Good to see some sensible meanings here, they are so rare.
It really is striking! All the BBC pundits seem to be neither pro-Portugal, nor pro-Turkey, nor pro-Spain nor whatever; the only real is consistency is: they are anti-german!!!
It is as simple as that! Sad and very silly!
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I know what you mean, but I don't think it's anti-german.
Germans are most interested in winning, and less interested in playing good football. (Although Klinsmann changed that in 2006, I feel it's resumed).
And Germans come across as arrogant because of their self determination to win above all else (they are not arrogant, I think this is just the perception).
So, I think alot of fans are not keen to see Germany win, because they react to the arrogance (their perception), not because they are anti-german.
It seems quite similar to Chelsea in England.
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As long as the Germans are underestimated, they are extremely dangerous. Look at the facts:
Germany took part in 6 of 11 World Cup finals since 1966.
Germany never went out of the world cup before the second round / quarterfinal.
Germany took part 6 of 10 European Cup finals since their first participation in 1972.
And last but not least, it was in 1982 when the last German player mist a penalty besides friendly matches (might be important on sunday).
To me, Spain is favorite as well. But you should stop talking like "Germany can't play football". People who say this just have no clue about the game.
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I watched the semi-final again. Fabregas's touches - his lobbed pass to Guiza for the goal was a demonstration of coolness under pressure and a deft touch. It reminded me of the best displays from Ronaldihno. Absolute masterclass. I noticed how Fabregas had incredible energy, one moment he was back defending, then racing down the left flank for that exquisite pass to Silva for the third goal. Sure Iniesta made a great pass to him, but Fabregas covered half the football field to setup Silva's goal. Joy to watch.
I don't read Phil's comments as anti-German, simply his way of rooting for an underdog (in terms of trophies won). A win for Spain will encourage other nations to adopt a similar, attacking style of play. They remind me of Brazil - talented, entertaining individuals. Germany in contrast has fireworks that last for a few milliseconds, and then they are back to defending.
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