- 25 Jun 08, 09:50 AM
Basel - 1,883 miles travelled
German newspaper Bild and Turkish counterpart Hurriyet both carried the same headline on Monday.
It read: "Let friendship win".
And wherever you look, all the right people are making all the right noises ahead of Wednesday's Euro 2008 semi-final between the two nations here in Basel.
German coach Joachim Loew has spoken in glowing terms of his experience as coach of Turkish side Fenerbahce during the 1998-99 season, talking of "incredible hospitality" and the welcome "with open arms" that he received, while Turkey rival Fatih Terim, after sagely acknowledging that one team will have to lose, has declared that "hopefully football will be the winner".
As for Hamit Altintop, one of two Turkish players born and raised in the country he will face on Wednesday, he has insisted: "I owe Germany a lot... better, everything."
But the sincere goodwill from those directly involved cannot detract from the inevitable concern that there could be problems.
There are close to three million people of Turkish descent in Germany, and a survey in newspaper Die Zeit earlier this year claimed half of them felt unwelcome in their adopted country.
Politicians admit there is poor integration of Turkish people in Germany and are using the semi-final to highlight the issue. For example, while there are no players of Turkish origin in the German squad, there are nine of Polish descent.
Claudia Roth, co-head of the German Green Party, says that the fact that Altintop and Hakan Balta have both chosen to play for Turkey rather than Germany is not a good sign either. "We have to be able to neutralize young people. We have to given them the feeling they belong here," she told Hurriyet.
Many supporters of Loew's team have followed their fortunes at the huge public viewing arenas across Germany and will turn out in great number again for the semi-final. At the Brandenburg Gate in Berlin alone, almost 500,000 are expected to watch the match on the big screens.
It is the over-riding hope of everyone concerned that there is no trouble. But as Frings08 wrote in response to my blog on Tuesday: "The mood in Germany is one of apprehension. Most of us Germans are worried about the potentially violent consequences of the semi-final."
There is also a sizeable Turkish community in Basel, while an estimated 60,000 Germans are expected to make the short trip across the border to Switzerland for the game. Many Turkish fans turned up at the stadium on Tuesday evening to try to catch a glimpse of their heroes ahead of the team's final training session, climbing railings to improve their vantage point.
Coach Terim has more than enough to occupy his attention without thinking about what might happen off the pitch. With five players out injured and four suspended, preparations have been far from straightforward.
But if selection issues are playing on his mind, he wasn't giving much away. He described his players as "strong and courageous", talked about their ambition, quoted Albert Einstein and said Turkey had not yet completed what they came here to do.
Terim's rambling answers often seemed to have only a notional relevance to the question, and he reminded me of a grave and serious lecturer imparting on his charges information so profound they would only partially comprehend what he had to say.
The 54-year-old's team have staged three astonishing comebacks to defeat Switzerland, Czech Republic and Croatia, but he swatted away any talk of miracles. "As far as I know, there are three possible results in football and 'miracle' is not one of them," he said. "I do not believe in miracles."
Before Terim arrived for his chat with the media, I spoke to Turkish television commentator Kerem Oncel, who had a more rational explanation for the team's glut of late goals. American trainer Scott Piri, part of the German backroom staff at the 2006 World Cup, has been working with Turkey, and his methods, reckons Oncel, have been paying dividends.
I asked Oncel how many people back home would be watching the match on TV and listening to his commentary. "All of Turkey," came the modest reply. The exploits of the Turkey team, he added, had given great pleasure to the many poor people, who have temporarily forgotten their problems. Terim, likewise, noted that what his team have done has united a people known for their "heated debate".
For the Germans, reaching the last four of a major tournament is hardly new territory, and, with a match against a decimated side, there is guarded optimism that "Die Mannschaft", as they are known back home, will be in Vienna on Sunday.
Torsten Frings will return for the game despite his broken rib, with Simon Rolfes, known as the new Michael Ballack in Germany, making way.
Frings is one of three leaders of the team - along with Jens Lehmann and Ballack - but he has not yet recaptured the form he showed in 2006. Back then, he was seen as a key reason why Germany reached the last four - and many still believe that had he played against Italy the team would have reached the final.
Frings was suspended retrospectively for that match after Italy appealed to Fifa following the midfielder's part in a post-match scuffle following Germany's quarter-final victory over Argentina. Needless to say, Italy's defeat on penalties to Spain was greeted with much joy in Germany.
Opinion is split as to whether the current German team is superior to the World Cup side of two years ago, but there is widespread approval for Loew. He is very professional when dealing with the media, a shrewd tactician and a great enthusiast of the game.
One German radio journalist - Burkhard Hupe of ARD - told me that he is the most tactically complete coach of their national team since Sepp Herberger, the legendary figure who presided over the 1954 World Cup success.
Loew's approval rating with his national media might have slipped slightly on Tuesday, when he turned up 25 minutes late for his press conference. It was most uncharacteristically German, prompting Loew to apologise at length.
Loew went on to pay tribute to the fast pace of the Premier League for ensuring that Ballack has been so fit and strong at this tournament - he ran further than any other player during the group stage - and talked up the mental strength of Turkey.
He looked serious but relaxed, and nattily dressed as always in a light brown shirt that must have been made to measure. But then, with the assembled media starting to hit their stride, he was off, just five minutes after he arrived.
The coach had a huge grin as he left the stage, suggesting a man for whom all is right in the world. But will he still be smiling on Wednesday night?
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Who would not share paper's comments? Let the friendship win... To be honest, noone wants trouble on both sides. Turks along with other immigrants that live in Germany already are subject to many racist neo-nazi cult groups attacks, burned homes etc. Germany does not want that to happen with excuse of the game. I just hope it does not happen if Turkey win against Germany or oppositely, provocations made between...
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Whoever wins, it should be free Donna Kebabs all round in Berlin
Thats a good way of maintaining good friendship
If they hold back on the mayo that is
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I don't think the Turkish fans (including the ones in Germany) will be very amused at the treatment of their team in comparison to that of Germany. UEFA have refused to let Turkey call up new players despite allowing the Germans to do so in 1996. Plus UEFA have decided to keep the tow-match ban on Volkan despite giving just one-match ban to Schweinsteiger. Both players had committed the same foul. And to make it clear I'm not saying all this just because we lost to Germany last week. We lost because of our rubbish keeper and defence not because of UEFA's help towards the big countries. Whatever the result tonight I won't be surprised if there are race riots in Germany. That said I hope Turkey win tonight so that the franco-german axis in UEFA lose thus making Euro 2008 even more of a farce by having the first non-European team to reach the final of a EURO Cup.
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Sorry, but as there are some errors in your article I like to bear a hand! ;-)
1. The Name of the turkish player is Hamit Altintop without r!
2. The name of the co-head of the German Green Party is Claudia Roth -she is a woman! ;-)
On the integration-point:
Many turkish people are integrated very well in Germany. Most of the group that aren`t integrated are part of a heavy religious conservative group. Many of them moved from Turkey to Germany because they were not even accepted in their own country. They aren`t very willing to integrate as they prefer to be on their own...
How do you integrate poeple which aren`t willing to do so?!
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"How do you integrate poeple which aren`t willing to do so?!"
You don't renew the visas for such people....
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I live in Germany, in an inner city area in which the Turkish flags hanging out of windows just about out-number the German ones.
Whatever the result; whether the German or the Turkish team - or indeed friendship - wins tonight, I know for certain that my wife and I are going to lose ..... several hours of sleep that is!The procession of victorious fans in their cars, honking their horns around the city's streets will go on long into the night.
Sadly there were some ugly scenes at the World Cup as the local Italians celebreated their semi-final win over the Germans and the Italian population nowadays is quite small. Being realistic, I expect a few confrontations on the streets tonight. We might have to move into the air raid shelt ... er ... I mean ... cellar for the night.
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#4
Corrections made. Thanks.
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I live in Germay as well and I think that most turks hope but do not expect to win tonight. Trouble may occur in the inner cities but I think it won´t be as bad as some people seem to want.
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Turkey will do well not to get hammered 5-0.
I know thier ravaged by injuries and susupensions and the fact that their contemplating to play their 3rd choice keeper outfield shows how critical things are but even if they had their strongest team out they still would have lost. Not taking anything away from their wins but all those teams were beatable, but to think they have any chance tonight is just wishful thinking and optimistic.
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J-Low sounds like a decent guy and without a doubt the victory will be his side's.
and if turkey is not a European country that makes some of the ancient greek cities pretty non-european and i, as a Cypriot, find it both unacceptable and ignorant.
one last thing, i thing German authorities should have a look a their citizenship laws first. may be they have always seen turks as guest workers.
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As you refer to the Frings8 comment that I replied to, you forgot to mention my response which was that as I live right next to one of largest populations of Turkish people outside of Turkey itself (Kreuzberg, Berlin) that panicky and slightly racist undertone was that the Turkish will raise hell if their team loose.
Not only that he said that the Germans are frightened of their Turkish neigbours, whilst not just refuting this I also think the Germans with their overpowering (newly rediscovered) nationalism is mre of a worry.
Especially given the indiscriminate attacks of right wing groupings that are on the increase rather than the decrease, I think Mr Fletcher you'd be better paid playing down the so-called "threat" posed not play it up.
I (being English myself) am bombarded day and night with a German media that is anything other than impartial when reporting on sport and actually quite insulting, put that with the German flags and baseball caps shirts etc etc of the people and that is enough to make you say "I'll be glad when it's all over"
Never mind the game!
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iam a Turkish,,but i think Turkey will lost with the card manipulations before!There is wrong artifices for everytime against Turkey.This is a normal conditions for me.Maybe we can win it in the field.But if we loss the match i wont get worry for anything!Because.i know Turkey fear of Europe and also simple evulations in every area!!! i cannot wonder that
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"You don't renew the visas for such people...."
Clearly you have no idea what you are talking about! Very much fits with the trend you have set. Turkish community is much like Asian community in UK in as far as how they got to be in Germany. They are second, third fourth generation of immigrants to Germany, and in many cases are German citizens. No visa involves here.
You have been on these sport boards and running you Anti Turkish campaign. Asking why Turkey is allowed to play in Europe: Turkey was
accepted by UEFA much like Armenia, Israel, Georgia and thus part of these championship. Same way as Australia was accepted by Asian confederation and played in Asian championship.
I realized you really issue has to do with
Turks being none-Europeans. Well, how would you like if I being part Scot and German question the Europeanness of Portugal? Gee Adolf, these Portuguese look more North African and certainly lot less European looking than the Turks, kick them out of Europe and have them play with their Mediterranean cousins form north Africa.
I of course don't mean it, but a warning if you are going to draw boundaries be warned other can draw a different boundary and may look at you much as you you view the Turks. What makes you think rest of the Europe views Portugal or Portuguese any better than the Turkey and the Turks? Take your bigotry to a white nationalist site.
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By the way Fletch, Frings is a right diver and not up to the form of a couple of years ago neither is the team, I know this as I watch Bundesliga games and am not impressed by some German journos, telling me how great the team is instead of doing some proper research.
Ballack is not in the form of WC '06 Schweisteiger is, whilst Podolski is just about second choice after Toni and Klose at Bayern.
If Germany had to face a "tall" team that could move fast and put their back four under pressure then I'm sure everbody would see how poor germany really is.
They would have then to rely on that old "Turkish" characteristic of fighting on till the bitter end.
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Re: Post 3,
Germany's calling up of another player to cover injuries was not as simple as you make it out,
Germany had several players; Kohler, Basler, Bobic ruled out with three others, Klinsmann, Helmer and Ziege doubtful (although all played in the end). They also had Möller and Reuter suspended after being booked in the semi final against England.
UEFA decided to give Germany special dispensation to change a member of their squad but ONLY if the Czech Republic agreed. They would also allow the Czechs to replace a squad member. The Czech Republic gave their consent for Germany to call up Jens Todt in place of Mario Basler but waived their right to call up a replacement of their own as they had no such injury concerns.
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In case I'm mistaken isn't Kevin Kuranyi of Turkish decent? He certainly looks it and I think he's in the German squad isn't he?
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Germany's calling up of another player to cover injuries was not as simple as you make it out
***************************
That's as may be, but Turkey have only 15 players available for selection, 3 injured players and 4 suspended.
They may even be forced to use the goal keeper as a striker!
So there's an even stronger case for allowing 1-2 players to added to the squad
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In case I'm mistaken isn't Kevin Kuranyi of Turkish decent? He certainly looks it and I think he's in the German squad isn't he?
***************
NO
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Ah Kuranyi is of Hungarian decent. My mistake....but he is in the squad I got that right!
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Turkey was accepted uefa just like israel armenia and georgia is totally false..
because 4 cities of turkey belong to europe continent.
it means turkey have land in europa an its not non europa.
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Ah Kuranyi is of Hungarian decent. My mistake....but he is in the squad I got that right!
********************************
He's Brazilian and not in the squad
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He's Brazilian and IS in the squad
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Well he's of many decents...Brazilian, Hungarian and such. And he is in the squad go and look.
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Kuranyi has a german-hungarian dad, and panamanian mother, was born in brazil, so was eligble for brazil, germany, hungary and panama
He is in the squad for Euro 2008.
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Quote: while there are no players of Turkish origin in the German squad, there are nine of Polish descent
That is utter nonsense! Klose and most of the others are ethnic Germans ("Aussiedler" in German). Only post-WWII territorial shifts led to their birthplace being Polish.
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And why is ethnicity so important matter LastGoalinWembley? Still good memories of WW2?
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@StormSiSL
Sorry, I did not bring up the ethnicity debate. Furthermore, "ethnic German" is a somewhat technical term, a crude translation of "Aussiedler" (German people moving from Romania, Poland and Russia into Germany ever since the end of WWII). My objection was rather about the "Polish descent" which is just not correct. No right-wing spirit at all.
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Let's take it back to where this blog started from: Turkish and German football fans and the fears of clashes after the game.
First of all: lots of countries have got issues with other countries when it comes to football.
Secondly: the vast majority of football supporters in ANY country just wants to have a good time.
Thirdly: Football supporters in Germany (including the flag display) during the World Cup and the recent European Cup have shown that they are NOT some neo-Nazi crowd. Media coverage is trying to inject a positive atmosphere (something that some Polish media should try and learn from!!!!)
Finally: as soon as alcohol is involved, they're can always be a problem. Some human beings turn into animals when they have too much booze (an international phenomenon, I guess Brits know some interesting stories there!).
I guess there'll be problems here and there but the huge crowd that gathers for the public viewings will celebrate the football match and show you people that Germany have come a far war since the last time ignorant people have developed some kind of prejudiced stereotype of the German or the Turkish.
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First of all, that "Bild" is asking for friendship is pure hypocrisy. That tabloid is worse than what we know here in Britain and they jump at every opportunity to create heated debates about "foreigners". The reason why they can't do that now is the public opinion about that match against Turkey. But just wait until after the Euro, you will see xenophobic headlines in no time.
Secondly, no one calls the German national team "Die Mannschaft" in Germany. The team is called "national team" or "Nationalmannschaft", which is the literal translation. I always wonder how things like "Die Mannschaft" made it into "common knowledge". And no - Germans rarely wear Lederhosen and don't eat Sauerkraut all day. Not even in Bavaria.
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I think that Germans are going to have a hard night. Turks can do it with a little luck as things pictured up to now, so I wish them all the best. Go on neighbours!!
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Claudia Roth, co-head of the German Green Party, "We have to be able to neutralize young people. We have to given them the feeling they belong here," she told Hurriyet.
Neutralizing young people sounds a little harsh, even for the Green Party, what does she mean, carbon neutral?
Naturalize might be better..
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Mehmet Scholl played for Germany and Bayern.
The fact is that many Turkish players who could and would play for Germany aren't selected by germany as they are deemed not good enough.
We on the other hand actively search german leagues to find eligable players. This blend helped us improve over the years as they are brought up with german footballing phiolosophy but also feel very passionate about playing for Turkey.
Swiss team had 3 Turkish players and they all said the same thing "did anyone (Turkish FA) asked me to play for Turkey and I said no?". This shows when we are late to the party and if they are good enough they can play for either nation.
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#31
She might have meant Naturalisation although can't be sure.
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I am going home now to watch the game.
If we lose I hope we lose with dignity.
If we win I hope we win with dignity.
After all football is a common language that connects a lot of people around the world.
Let the football win for a change.
Thanks ppl and good luck.
trained_killa
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I am German and I am all for integration, Germans need to be more welcoming and some Turkish need to be making more efforts to integrate, its a two way street. What I can not stand though, is this PC behaviour we have seen in the last couple of days, its a game of emotions and Germans and Turks should celebrate together - this could be an evening of understanding.
I am still happy if Turkey loses tonight. And no politican can tell me to think PC and be happy if Turkey wins.
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Whatever the whatever is, I as a neutral really , really don't want to have to watch a 90 minute German procession in a non-match because of Turkey's injury and susupensions and maybe a gulf in class.
I've seen these hopelessly one-sided games before where one team has gone a round too far.
One thing they aren't is a spectacle.
I so hope I am proved completely wrong.
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U11148453,
My objection to Turkey being in Euro 2008 and other European competitions has to do with Turkey not being in Europe. Same with Israel, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Georgia. And if you're wondering, I'm not white so take your generalisations elsewhere. And it's got nothing to do with Turks being Moslems. There are countries in Europe with Moslem majorities (Kosovo is an example) but they should be allowed in European competitions because they are in Europe. Australia is in Oceania and so should compete against Oceanian teams not Asian ones. Furthermore I'm not talking about race. There are Portuguese people who are darker than Turks and vice-versa. My objection to Turkey being in European competitions is purely geographical....
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Then you are quite misinformed my friend Portguese...
If you have 20 euros in your pocket, turn its back and look at the map. You will see Turkey has been included there till Istanbul.
So, Turkey's (Trakia) side is completely in Europe where 15 million Turks live and this land is in Turkey borders... That's a crowded part of Europe, which is far more crowded some Europe countries themselves.
Now, it is also same with Russia, "a part of russia" is in Europe, but bigger part is in Asia. Same goes for Turkey. You can also use geographical maps or even Google Earth. Basically, someone in Istanbul can ride to Greece and Bulgaria in 3 hours without crossing any sea...
Seriously, your objection just based on lack of geographical ignorance, nothing more...
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If you remember the last Euro championship, Turkish team wasn't there but all the Turkish origin people in Germany was supporting Germany with their German Flags
and BBC and British tabloids was doing good comments about Turks in Germany saying that how well integrated Turks in Germany ...
now if you go to germany tonight you will see that most Turks carrying two flags...German and Turkish
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Can someone, please, tell me where the "European Continent" begins, and where it ends??????While you are at it, please take the time to explain what a continent is.
I always thought a "continent"was a large land mass surrounded by sea :-(
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Further more, I don't expect any trouble regardless of the results; I think that hooliganism is restricted to "League Football"...Not to the great tournaments.
So, if there is any violence after the match, it will not be "fooball related"; it will be more a case of ultra-nationalism taking advantage of a sport's great tournament to soil the flags and reputation of all nationalities involved. Go Germany! Go Turkey! May the best team win! And, let's get back to anormal life, as soon as possible!
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I am Turkish/American/Muslim and particularly a crazy football fan, I think Switzerland and Austria did a wonderful job for this tournament. Anyone is involved with this tournament needs recognition. This is just a game. I wish Turkey won but they did not. I would like to thank Turkish players for their effort to do best they could. I wish best for the Germany in the Finals. I know 90% of the Football lovers around the world appreciated Turks for adding some exitement to the tournament. Other 10% are racist, narrow minded or simply has no basic human quality. I think all referees are trying to be just. They may have made some mistakes but it was not intentional at all. Can we be little fair on our comments? Advancement in technology gave us so much more than what we need, I am seeing racist videos, faul language, plotical messages against Turks, I wish these people can get out of the dark and enjoy being a human being. Missing England from this tournament is may be the most disaapointing. Thanks
Nuri Bulut
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