Pick your classic Hungarian Grand Prix
The Hungarian Grand Prix does not exactly have a reputation as the most thrilling of Formula 1 events but our trawl through the archive for our classic races series has thrown up some crackers.
Nestled in a natural amphitheatre, the Hungaroring's twisty nature makes overtaking tricky - Martin Brundle once described it as "a street circuit without the houses" - so it has become notorious for processional races.
There have certainly been a few of those - where else except perhaps Monaco would Thierry Boutsen's Williams have been able to hold off Ayrton Senna's McLaren for virtually the entire race, as the Belgian did on his way to victory in 1990, for example?
It is also fair to say that while the F1 community, in general, looks forward to going to Hungary, that is more to do with the charms of wonderful Budapest, where everyone stays for the weekend, than it is those of the dusty race track.
Yet the Hungaroring has also produced some grands prix that will be remembered as long as cars race.
One of those events, paradoxically, is 1990 - for exactly the reasons I gave. There have also been some landmark moments in Hungary.
The inaugural event in 1986 was the first grand prix to take place behind the Iron Curtain. (And it remained the only one until it opened its borders in 1989, just a few months before the fall of the Berlin Wall).
Hungary was also the location of the first career grand prix wins of Damon Hill (1993), Fernando Alonso (2003) and Jenson Button (2006), as well as the place where Michael Schumacher equalled in 2001 Alain Prost's then-record of 51 wins - the German going on to add another 40 before he was done.
But it is the great races we are interested in here, and the first of those we have chosen is that first Hungarian race (if we leave aside Tazio Nuvolari's win at Nepliget in 1936), which featured some great racing between Brazilian rivals Nelson Piquet and Senna.
(It also, by the way, signalled the moment when the relationship between Piquet and Williams-Honda team-mate Nigel Mansell really started to sour, after Piquet discovered a new differential transformed his car but failed to tell Mansell, who struggled to finish third, well of the pace).
Our second selection is 1988, part of the classic showdown that took place between McLaren team-mates Senna and Prost that summer.
Fast-forward a year and turbo engines have gone from F1 but Senna is again at the centre of things - this time on the end of one of the most opportunistic overtaking manoeuvres of all time, courtesy of Mansell, who was now at Ferrari.
Eight years later, and we have the extraordinary events of 1997, when Hill incongruously led most of the way in his Arrows-Yamaha only to suffer a problem with the electronics controlling his throttle and lose what would have been one of the most remarkable victories in F1 history on the very last lap to Jacques Villeneuve.
Finally, we have chosen Button's maiden victory in 2006, a thrills-packed wet race featuring just about everything you could wish for in a grand prix, including brilliant drives from the eventual winner and the man whose late retirement made it easier, Alonso.
So, please let us know which one you would like us to highlight in the run up to this year's Hungarian Grand Prix next week.
To close, I thought it might be a good idea to remind you how this works.
You tell me which race is your favourite by responding below, and I take those views into account ( I do count up the 'votes', but this is not a vote, per se) when deciding which event to highlight with a detailed back story on this blog next week.
We will make short-ish highlights videos of all five races available on this website and on the BBC red button - which so far has meant between five and nine minutes. But if the winning race falls in the years when the BBC had the F1 contract (ie, before 1997), we will broadcast the full 'Grand Prix' highlights programme of the time.
The love affair has blown hot and cold, but Formula One has had me in its spell for most of my life. After 16 years covering the sport, in which I have reported from more than 100 Grands Prix, I am as thrilled by its heights, fascinated by its complexities and exasperated by its idiosyncrasies as ever. I hope there will be plenty of all of them to share with you now F1 is back on the BBC. You can also follow me on
© MMIX~RS~q~RS~~RS~z~RS~59~RS~)
Comments
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1997 was so painful to watch! A great drive but a heart-breaking ending.
But the winner surely has to be 1989 and an equally brilliant drive by Nigel Mansell. I'd love to see him coming through the field in Extended Highlights!
Out of interest, why no 1998? Schumacher was brilliant that year.
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OK. 1998 wasn't selected?? True it wasn't great in terms of actual racing but it is perhaps one of the greatest strategic victories of all time.
1989 would be my first choice, simply because i love the late eighties / early nineties era of F1. Plus it was Mansell at his brilliant best - I also would love to see what his reaction was at the end of the race, I can't remember if he moaned as much as he usually did!!!
2nd choice would be 1997. Even though I wasn't a Damon fan, I was still really gutted that he didn't quite pull off the dream win
1986 was more intriguing than exciting (except for the Piquet pass) and 2006 is too recent to be shown again (though it should rightly be considered as a classic in future years). As for 1988, what actually happened in that race?
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Call me xenophobic and chauvinist and all sorts of other things, but the best ones for me are the ones where the Brits came out on top - 1989, 2007, and 1993 and in that order - Nige's stunning drive and that classic overtake on Ayrton, Jenson coming from way down the grid to drag his dog of a Honda to victory, and Damon's debut win, spoiled a little by Alain Prost making a porridge of things by stalling on the parade lap.
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Sorry, of course I meant 2006 for Jenson - I must be getting old!!!
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Was actually at the '04 race but I wouldn't call that a classic.
Out of the five races that are there, well '97 and '06 were certainly memorable(Damon proving that he could do something in the Arrows) but again I'll go old school. '89 please, would be interesting to see Mansell in a Ferrari.
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1988 = Senna led from start to finish with the exception of a few seconds where Prost got up the inside of Senna for turn one but out-braked himself allowing Senna to re-pass him instantly. Murray Walker fans should note that he does not commentate in this race, it is Simon Taylor.
1989 for me - surely it has to win and because the other Hungaroring races in the BBC era are such a bore, would be great if this was shown in full on BBCi.
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I think I remember that in the FOCA season review, thanks Senna27
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I'm surprised there is no mention of 1992 as it was the race where Nigel Mansell won the world championship - even though he didn't do particularly well in the race itself. A young Michael Schumacher did drive very well in one of his first races in what was at the time still an uncompetitive Benetton.
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Agree with KenFayers. 1992 is surely one of the best races. A charge through the field when Mansell had the puncture, Overtaking, crashes (Schumacher's rear wing flying off)
However, of those choices above, 1990 please.
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Two extended highlights go to 1986 and 1988 not only because we get to see the prgrams for them but they contain some really important and intresting Grand Prix.
If it was possible to get longer highlights for 1997 and 2006 i would love to them also. 1997 was a heartbreaking race to see Damon finally show the form that made him a World Champion in a car was a pile of junk compared to what he left behind only to run out of petrol and be passed by 9kn my opinion) one of the worst driver's champions of all time (Jacques Villeneuve). 2006 was a mechanical demolition derby because all of the leading runners had so many problms it was ridiculous and it was great to fianlly see Jenson Button get on the top step (i reckon he would have beaten Alonso on the track because he had greater pace and a good stratergy based on my recollection so i wish i could see that.
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I would love to see mansell fight it out in a ferrari against senna so 1989 for me please.
Suprised 1992 and 1998 aren't on the list. Not much happened on the track in 1998 I grant you but the tactical genius of Schumacher and Brawn is well worth seeing again!
2006 a close second as well. (If the votes are tied you could take second choises into account?)
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Are there 4 or 5 choices? There's 1986, 1988, 1997, and 2006, was 1990 also in the mix?
I'd like to see 1988 actually!
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89 please
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I'm mistaken I believe, it's 1986, 1988, 1989, 1997, and 2006.
So I'll change my vote to 1989!
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I would want to see '88, followed by '97, then '89.
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The phrase "A Classic Hungarian Grand Prix" could be considered an oxymoron. Surely a classic example of a Grand Prix at Hungary would be a low activity race with very little overtaking, such as in 2004. I am glad to see that Andrew has picked 5 races that bucked the trend.
For me the 1989, 1997 and 2006 races stick in the memory. My vote goes to 1989.
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'97 from the choices given, but I would have rather had '98 on the list, Schumacher drove brilliantly.
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If you;re offering extended 1989 highlights Andrew - you're on!
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Got to be `89. Although Piquet's overtake on Senna in 86 was one of the best overtaking moves i have ever seen.
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1997 for me please - the only Grand Prix I missed that year...I was truly gutted when I heard the result.
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1998 was brilliant - I can't believe it hasn't been chosen! The fantastic, 3-stopping Michael against the far superior 2-stopping McLarens and leap frogged them both. I remember being sat with a DC/McLaren fan of the time who was convinced that they had it in the bag - and then Schumi pulled it right out of the bag and took an amazing win. Definitely my favourite Hungarian GP that I've seen.
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1989, has to be my 1st choice head and shoulders above the rest, 06 comes a removed 2nd and 96 a distant 3rd.
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Bleh 1998. I bet Schumacher didn't have to try to hard to beat Hakkinen when his McLaren was ailing. He went off the road and still had a chance to win.
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Hi,
1989 please.
Whilst I appreciate that the list of classic races shows no bias to either the BBC or ITV eras, there really is no point in "voting" for post-1996 as the same duration gets shown.
What I can't understand is why you can't just cut the beginning and end off the ITV highlights from post-1996 races to make entended highlights of those. Surely that can't be more work that syncing a whole race of 5 live commentary to "world feed" pictures and making a 5 minute edit (as is done for post-Murray races.)
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2006. Obviously.
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I would like to see the 1989 race please.
Firstly the cars of this year looked and sounded great and secondly for Nigel Mansells charge through the field. This was a weekend when Nigel used his head as well as his balls. He could not get the car to work in qualifying and on Saturday he spent the session honing the car for a good race set up. As the hour progressed he saw his grid place fall further and further back, but he had the confidence that the car was sorted and ready for the race.
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I would go with 2006 on this one because the weather, and qualifying penalties, turned the whole race upside down. It is a shame that 1998 isn't amongst the list, but the ones that you have chosen are an excellent choice
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1989 - one of the great overtaking moves, absolutely stunning. But only the last in a series of them as Mansell worked his way up from 13th (I think) on the grid.
Otherwise, Damon Hill in an Arrows overtaking Schumacher in a Ferrari - a great moment, then heartbreak on the last lap.
(I'm assuming the overtaking move will not be overlaid by a commercial break, as happened on the ITV live coverage...)
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Alonso!s win please
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1989 please, as it was the year my love of F1 really took off.
If I'm allowed a second vote, I'd like to see Jenson's maiden victory in 2006, only as I missed it as I was away on honeymoon at the time!
PS
Let's hope Sooty doesn't get too close to Raikkonen next weekend....could be a good circuit for the Force India?
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I'm amazed 1998 didn't get a mention! A fantastic race, a fantastic victory for Schumacher with credit to Brawn.
Out of those, my vote goes for 2006.
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1997 please
Brilliant drive by damon so unlucky at the end
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1986, 1988 or 1989 please. Don't mind which as long as we get a full highlights programme or programmes (hint, hint).
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gotta be 97, although im tempted by mansells win, it just doesnt overcome my detestation of ferrari :D
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It always annoys me when people say that the Hungarian GP is boring.
Just looking at the few races you have mentioned says enough.
I mean 89 and 92 were also amazing races. (Pity 92 isn't on the list just for the nostalgia of Mansell's title win). Heck, even last year's race was exciting.
I'll go for 1989 then 86, 06,97
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97, 97, 97, 97 ... Heart breaking... C'mon even the orange arrows was better than the yamaha... True classic race.
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1989 please.
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I still haven't got over 1997.
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2006 had everything including an extremely bizarre crash between raikkonen and liuzzi, 2006 for me was a great race won by my favourite driver so although there are some other great races, 2006 is a modern classic!
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1989 definitely. There is absolutely no point whatsoever in voting for 97 or 06 because even if they win we will only get to see a 5 mins highlights video, which we would still see even if they don't win. Why does no-one ever realize this?
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1997 for me, that race still stands out in my memory and was heartbreaking to watch
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It has to be 2006, Jenson Button was my Favourite Driver at the time (And still is but just not as much as Hamilton) I even cried when he won I was so happy for him and i just want to see it again!
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Also i just remembered the 2007 race that was really good too...
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Not 1997 or 2006 because we don't actually gain anything...
...therefore 1989.
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1998 was arguably Schumacher's greatest victory, but I'm not sure a brief highlights package can really capture the drama of how he banged in that series of fast laps, because if memory serves he was on his own on the racetrack at the time.
I was at the 97 race, the crowd was full of German Schumacher fans and even they stood up to chant Damon's name when he got up on the podium at the end, a really memorable afternoon.
I'd like to see that Boutsen victory from 90 again, didn't he stick it on pole and then didn't make a pit stop for the whole race, so basically there was a huge queue of cars behind him most of the time? I seem to remember Senna getting frustrated and punting Nannini off, and I think Berger doing the same to Mansell.
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Remember one of the headlines after the 2006 race.. "Schumacher drives without a brain". So true..
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1997 please!
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1989 please, with 1988 second.
Thanks to all those who choose a pre-97 era race. You'll still enjoy 5-9 minute highlights of your favourite Hungarian GP race but give us the opportunity to see a full BBC highlights for one of the pre-96 races.
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i think 1989 and 2006 rule and maybe 2005 would be brilliant
:)
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2006! Button starting 14th and coming through to beat Alonso and Schumi - shows just what a class driver he is. But please, please, please, USE the commentary of James Allen and Anthony Davidson. James' reaction is priceless!
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2006... was a great race and i remember watching it and how button stormed the field when it was wet.
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I vote for 1986 and 1988. All the old races - I like seeing the Grand Prix Program instead of the 8 minute summary videos.
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1989 please!
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@theblobinator
I feel i must correct you on your assesment of Jenson coming through to beat Alonso; He would have won if it wasnt for the rear wheel nut failure. Jense was flying that day, and pulled a great move on Schumy! But, would he have overtook Alonso? im not sure, that 2006 race, Alonso pulled out something from that bag of immense talent and truly outclassed the field alongside Button after his premature end. buttons win was ofcourse lucky, I mean schumi, Raikkonen, Alonso all had problems, 2 self brought on, 1 through team error. But hey, you need look in this game, no!?
on the other hand, Jense is a good driver, but i do fail to remember many overtakes from him or flare from him that you do see in drivers which ar champions....... kimi excluded now; ever since he left McLaren, his ice has melted or flame diminished. Whichever you like.
But my top choices is 2003 as it showed dominating performance from the future talent which is Alonso, who is still the youngest ever double champion and also a great drive from the other future talent which has.... well diminshed; Kimi raikkonen in second place.
2006 ofcourse is my second choice, because it was such a hectic race, and was it not the debut of Kubica? or was it his first points inwhich got took away and given to schumy? Let alone Kimi reckless mistake with Liuzzi.
Anyway, please, 2003 and 2006!
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Have ot og for the races won by British drivers- have been a bit rare for a while until this year! please 1989 -Mansell,1992 Nigel's WDC winner, 1997 and 2006.
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Hi Andrew,
2006 please. I'd love to see Jenson getting it all right and having his first win, again.
As a second choice, it has to be 1989. Seeing the race that 'Il Leone' got one over 'The Adversary' would make me smile;)
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1989. No question.
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Sorry 1997 for me it still hurts me too, for my second choice I'm going for 1989 Please. Love to see Jenson's first Win again but I've got it on tape some where.
Also for Spa I'm going for 1998 or 1992 but I'm hoping it will be 1998 that wins (even though it won't be full highlights, sadly)
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1997. No question.
One for Andrew - why can't you use the other side's commentary? After all Martin's one of your own and so Murray these days ...
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1997.... was I the only person cheering for Johnny Herbert in the closing stages?
(a far more talented driver than Hill ever was...)
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FanofSilverstone...
in my opinion one of the worst driver's champions of all time (Jacques Villeneuve)
I have to agree with that, as like Damon Hill the year before, they both won the title because of the supierority of their Adrian Newey designed Williams'
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1989 for me. Can't beat a bit of Mansell magic!
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As a Jenson fan, I have to say 2006, but that means you can't show it. :(
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Got to be 1989. The other races had moments of entertainment but none as good as a Mansell charge!
Second choice is 2006.
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even though im not a Jenson Button fan, 2006 was a great race from a neutral prospective (MS and FA coming through the field at the start) :)
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'89. Full highlights = good.
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Without question, 1989 full highlights please. One of Nigel's greatest ever drives from 12th on the grid. Nigel showed you can overtake in Hungary :)
You have to show 1992, a real champions drive from Mansell that secured him his maiden world championship win.
Would like to see 1993 again as this was Damon Hill's first Grand Prix win, having come so close in the previous 2 races that year.
1997 for sure, Damon came so close to giving the Arrows Team thier first win, only to loose it right at the end :(
And finally it's gotta be 2006, Jenson drove the race of his life to finally take his first Grand Prix win. Plus this was so far the only wet race that Hungary has ever had !!!
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definatly 2006, i've never seen anyone so happy about a first win, and its great witht beh situation we've had this year,
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I asked this on the Classic German GP results and have failed to recieve a response:
"Yet again the highlights are not on Freeview. Now I understand that you have other things to show on there but I looked at what was being shown at 18:30 today and its was Golf on one channel (Fair enough), and blank screen on the other with the guide saying that there was not going to be anything shown on the channel between 18:30 and 0:00. So why were the highlights not shown in that gap??? You say that you have no space available on freeview but it is quite clear that there is a 5 and a half hour gap with nothing being shown.
I hope a member of the BBC can answer that question for me as I would really like to know why.
As to the voting for these races, perhaps you should show full Grand Prix highlights for all those before 1997 and 5-10 minutes for the ITV ones, and then we vote on which race was actually the best, rather than vote on the ones we want to see. I'm sure I would of voted for 2000 in this weeks choices but because I knew that we might not get full Grand Prix highlights of another one, then I didn't. Voting for the one we think is best when we have seen them means that races like 1961 would have more of a chance of winning and would provide people with the knowledge of what the majority of people thought was the best race."
and this:
"Well if the races were shown on Freeview then why did Andrew say they were not going to be shown??? I'm not saying they were not shown, I just want to know why we were not told and why when there was another gap in the listings that they were not shown? I know I would of been able to watch them when Neo-Slider said they were on, but due to not being told they were on, and the fact I have bandwidth limits, I have been unable to watch them. Some communication is clearly lacking here."
As for my pick, it would be 1989. 1997 and 2006 were better but we won't get full highlights for them so 1989.
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My pick will be 1989 race when Mansell came from 12th on the grid and won the race with a good move on Senna using a backmarker to get by. It just showed you can pass at the Hungaroring even though the track is like "Monaco but without the houses." I remembered that race when I was a kid and still have memories watching the race and we get full highlights for the 1989 race so that will be my choice.
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As much as I would of liked to have seen 1998 and Schumi's epic win, I guess I'll have to vote for 1997. Damon's oh-so-near victory robbed at the death by electronics and JV.
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Extended highlights of 1989 and normal highlights of 2006 and 1998, please!
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Often described as the most boring race, it has thrown up many more exciting races than Barcelona in Spain.
1992 when Nigel Mansell won the championship could be a classic but only from a purely British point of view.
1997 when Damon Hill put in a giant killer drive only to be robbed cruelly at the end was heartbreaking, and denied Arrows their first win. This race was their best ever result.
1998 when Michael Schumacher and Ross Brawn stunned the paddock with an audacious change of strategy...arguably the best example of the power of their partnership.
2003 when Fernando Alonso lapped Michael Schumacher on the way to his first win, becoming the youngest ever winner on the way until Vettel at Monza last year.
2006 when Alonso and Schumacher made the rest of the field look like amateurs at the beginning, with Button able to capitalise on a cruel twist of fate for Alonso after a pit stop for his first win.
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1997 was a brilliant race, such a shame for Damon... Please show it, but cut it off before the end and we can all pretend Damon won!
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2006 PLEASE ONE OF MY ABSOLUTE FAVOURITES!!!
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being a lifelong Jenson Button fan not one of these glory hunting people who jump the band wagon i been supporting the man through thick and thin, gotta admit the previous 2 seasons have been hard,
hence for me it's Hungary 2006 as the classic race for me
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Suprised that 92 didnt make it into the top 5. Ok maybe not a classic but would be nice to see Mansell win the championship. The good thing about Hungary is that it allows the underdog a chance, and so it has to be Damon just missing out in 97, with a victorious jenson in 06 second. Can still remember watching both races, with different emotions!!
Dave
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Button as he deserved it. Closely followed by all the others. I would like extended highlights of 1997 but as tat isn't possible I'll go for 1986.
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A big error in 1998 not being included - one of Schumacher's finest victories. 1997 was highly impressive but for me it is 2006 as this is my favourite race victory. After six and a half seasons faith in Jenson Button was finally, finally redeemed with a fantastic win from 14th on the grid.
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1989
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Hi all,
Thanks for your overwhelming response already. This is just a quick comeback to some of your points.
Why no 1998? I can't win with you lot, can I?! You have a go at me for not picking more races from the BBC era so you can choose from more extended highlights, and then when I pick three of five from pre-1997 you don't like it!
I'm joking, of course. Nevertheless, it is true that had I picked 1998 - and, yes, it was a great race and a great drive; I was there - then we would most likely have to have dropped 1986 or 1988, which would have meant three post-1997 races, and only two extended highlights to choose from. Anyway, as I have said repeatedly on these blogs, there's always next year - and thank you for your other suggestions on that.
Freeview - I also noticed that the German races appeared on Freeview when we had said they wouldn't. Sorry about that. I will look into it and find an answer. Generally, though, if there are not a good few hours to loop it, the feeling is it's probably not worth it.
Button v Alonso in 2006 - I also think Alonso would have won that year had he not had his failure. But my friend Mark Hughes tells me Button was closing at 0.5secs a lap and had time to catch him. I guess we'll never know.
Commentary/the ITV era - we are only prepared to use BBC commentary, I'm afraid. Because Murray Walker was a BBC commentator before he joined ITV, and likewise Martin Brundle afterwards, that means we can use them when they were at ITV. Otherwise, in the ITV years, we have to join the footage with 5 Live commentary, which is a very labour intensive job. Either way, we do not have the resources to justify cutting half-hour highlights of these races in the time we would have (the BBC Grand Prix programmes already exist, of course), regardless of the commentators. Hence, the time restriction for the races from 1997-2008.
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2006 was an exciting race to watch and it was the track where button (who is now leading the championship)won his first ever F1 race.
2006 gets my vote
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74 : kristofpher wrote... 1997 was a brilliant race, such a shame for Damon... Please show it, but cut it off before the end and we can all pretend Damon won!
LOL
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2003 & 2006
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It's got to be 1997. Damon Hill in an Arrows passing Michael Schumacher in a Ferrari at the end of the straight. Of course ITV managed to have an advertisement break at the time. Two laps away from the most astounding victory. And the crows shouting "Damon, Damon, Damon.. " as he got on the second step of the podium. He was the Hungaroringmeister.
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I meant crowds not crows of course, but they were probably cheering too.
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To Andrew:
suggestion for the Murray/Martin ITV races. You say: "Either way, we do not have the resources to justify cutting half-hour highlights of these races in the time we would have (the BBC Grand Prix programmes already exist, of course), regardless of the commentators. Hence, the time restriction for the races from 1997-2008."
In case you don't realise, ITV did a race highlights programme each Sunday night after the Grand Prix approximately 45 minutes (once removing commercials). Remove the start of the programme where it is being introduced, remove the close of the programme as well as the break bumpers and you have a 30 minute programme.
That isn't so hard as from where I (and many others) are seeing things.
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Benson - the 2006 Race was classic for the famous James Allen moment...JENSON BUTTON WINNNNNNNS..........better then your current bloke.
Also 2006 saw Anthony Davidson used...surely you can have the ITV Commentary on as he is being used by Radio 5 Live.
I dont like the 5 Live commentary being used on the races covered by ITV, its dirorentated from the TV pictures.
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Definately 2006 - a real classic, with lots of action, rain and surprises.
Infact, since the rather dreary 2004 race, all of the races at the Hungaroring since haven't been that bad at all, contrary to popular criticisms of the circuit.
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As a side comment, D_M_N, I believe I worked on Wikipedia with you? On the Wikiproject Formula One, before I got made an administrator.
Lord_Lancashire (or Lradrama ;) )
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86 was great, remember Piquet's massive oversteer slide into turn one overtaking Senna.
Mansells amazing win in the Ferrari in 89 with that "trick of the light " pass on Senna.
Hills heartbreak in 87 & Jensons joy in 2006 those would be my top pics ..
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highlights of Hungary 1997 are all over youtube for those who continuously, and one has to say rather foolishly continue to vote for races that fall between the years of 1997 and 2008.
When will these folks learn!! Andrew has already spelt it out for you as have countless others, A VOTE FOR RACE BETWEEN 1997 AND 2008 IS A POINTLESS VOTE AS THE RACE WILL BE SHOWN ANYWAY. It is decided from the moment Andrew gives us the 'options' that any race that falls between 1997 and 2008 will be given around 5 mins REGARDLESS if it receives 0 votes or 1.5 billion.
Andrew, put the folks out their misery next time and simply do not mention an ITV race, just braodcast it anyway, because that is the actual outcome anyway.
By the way, you have my backing to keep the 90's and 00' races at a minimum. They are too recent and fresh in the memory.
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Senna27, I've said this once and I will say it again.
As much as you protest that you don't wish to see the newer races, they are put up because they are enjoyable and great to watch, whether it be on YouTube, here or whatever.
Many people do not care when a race was held whether it be recently, in the 80s or the Jurassic period for all I care, but we want to see them again because we are FANS - and once a great race, always a great race.
This is about picking CLASSIC races, not HISTORICAL races, and trust me, we've had a hell of a lot of CLASSIC races in the 90s and 00s.
As much as I love a blast from the past, a look back at a recent belter certainly does not go amiss. There are sadly always people on F1 websites who winge and put a downer on everything, and at the moment, you nicely fit the bill.
Andrew, you're doing a fine job btw.
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Senna27, you seriously need to calm down and get off your high horse, rather than going off on a whinging shouting rant at people every time. Get a grip and stop shouting at others and basically implying that they're stupid, there's no need for it, and you know it. Take a chill pill before you make yourself ill through all your pointless shouting at people.
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1989 please. I had hoped for 1990, and Boutsen's triumph (and Senna barging Nannini right off the circuit!)
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Got to be 1989 hasn't it? Great run from Mansell - didn't he qualify 12th? - on a circuit you can't overtake on! 1997 would be heartbraking to watch, but on the other had I only saw the start at the time and listened to it on the radio in the car. I think it was worse than watching it.
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Lord Lanc - You completely miss the point - yet again. My 'rant' is not about dictating to other what they should desire to see, instead it is about the continuous way in which people request for something which they are going to get anyway. To sum up, people are asking for something after they have been informed they will receive it! That is what I simply can not comprehend! And far from shouting, every request that falls into the ITV era just has me shaking my head with laughter at the sheer mystery of it all!
Steevy, I dont see where I have shouted at anyone. If anything, I detect a bit of attitude from you - if anything!
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1989, for showing that overtaking is possible at the Hungaroring!
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Senna27, I sympathise entirely with what you're saying.
The notion is simple:
1. All the races selected by Andrew will be shown as short summaries. That means whatever happens there will be short summaries of 1986, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1997 and 2006.
2. For races between 1979 and 1996, if enough people 'vote' for it they will show the full 30 minutes Highlights programme from the BBC archive instead of the summary.
Therefore, it is only worthwhile to vote for a race between 1979 and 1996.
If you desperately want to see 1997 Hungary and 2006 Hungary, then essentially you have nothing to worry about at all. Even if no one votes for either, they'll still get shown at the maximum length the BBC can manage.
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1989 please
Would love to have 1998 on there as it's the only race I regret missing whilst on holiday in my 18 years of following the sport.
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Thanks Incast!
Not sure exactly how many more times we have to rephrase the general formate before everybody understands.
Andrew, bless him, has even gone to lengths of spelling it out once again...
"We will make short-ish highlights videos of all five races available on this website and on the BBC red button - which so far has meant between five and nine minutes. But if the winning race falls in the years when the BBC had the F1 contract (ie, before 1997), we will broadcast the full 'Grand Prix' highlights programme of the time."
Yet....yet....people STILL (like my good friend Lord_Lanc for example) request for 2006 and such!!
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Having a go at people every time isn't neccesary Senna27, all you need to do is calmly say 'we get highlights of races from 97 onwards anyway, so I recommend you vote for races before then, so we can enjoy the full highlights programme as broadcast at the time' rather than shouting (sticking things in full capital letters comes across as shouting) and calling people foolish and such like. You could be calmer and not go on the offensive so much on this subject. Not a critism, merely saying don't get so worked up and name call/shout/get mad at people.
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And a suggestion for Andrew. Do seperate votes for pre 97 races, and post 97 races, that way you avoid this situation. Choose 5 races pre 97 (the 3 with the most votes get the full programme shown, the other 2 get short highlights) and choose 5 races post 97 (depending on the track obviously) and have the 3 winning races gettin the short highlights treatment, the other 2 don't get anything
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Hello Stevvy,
Well you suggest I should calmly say...
Well, I think you'll notice people have been "calmly" trying to explain the format countless times since the very first vote was up for the first race of the season. The "calmly approach clearly isn't working, evidident by the tally of votes for Hungarian classic races falling between 1997 and 2008.
Also, capital letters does not equate to shouting. It merely serves to highlight an important point, particularly as there is no way to write in bold.
And finally, I haven't called anybody names even though for some oddd reason you continue to isist I have done so. I have mentioned 'foolish' actions which I believe is fitting when considering the countless times people on here such as JonVic, Incast, myself, as well as Andrew have tried to draw attention to the 'voting' format.
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98 is also a good choice simply for the fact that Schumi was at his best that day with his probably 2nd most ambitious strategy call ever, behind his 4 stop race in France.
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Andrew
Thanks for clearing up the voting v's BBC full hightlights issue that has been dogging these boards for a few weeks.
My vote goes to 1989 as i've never seen it, simple as that.
I have to say though, Hill's drive in the Arrows was incredible. We get so used to the same few teams winning nowadays and get all excited about Webber getting 5th in a Minardi a few years ago in Melbourne, but for Hill, to be kicked out of Williams as reigning World Champion and to almost pull off one of the most incredible feats ever in F1 history in dry conditions by being a few miles away from victory in an Arrows is amazing. Its even a better Drive than 1998 at Spa, (and i'm not even a big D.Hill fan)
Will look forward to you selecting Schuey's 1998 run at Hungary next year.
Terrible circuit though, how they've hung onto it is anyone's guess? (Oh yeah.. i believe they gave Bernie the Freedom of Budapest or some such Honour a few years ago.. Long may the Yawns continue. Still it might rain this year.. fingers crossed)
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2006 please
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1997 because it was just so unexpected and truly a superb drive in a horrid piece of machinery, this place was the one place where Damon Hill actually looked truly unbeatable all thrughout his career.
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Can't believe 1998 wasn't a choice. One of Schumacher's best ever drives. managed to gain enough time for a pit stop in the space of 20 laps or so. Whatever people think of him personally, there was no denying that it was an awesome drive.
But from the choices, 1989 was great. Close racing at the front, and Mansell came through from 12th to win with an opportunistic pass on Senna to claim the lead, having already overtaken Prost as well before that.
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I could have cried at 1997, not sure if i could handle watching it again.
Didn't he stuff a move up the inside of Schumacher into turn one?
Proof if needed that Damon was actually a pretty good race driver.
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As for the whole ITV thing... i'm getting a wee bit bored listening to all this, i'm just thankful we get to see ANYTHING from the ITV era!
I started watching formula one in 1997 as a 10 year old so technically i've only ever known F1 from an ITV perspective (it also explains why I didn't have too big a problem with the ad breaks!).
So I particularly enjoy watching the extended BBC coverage to see/hear the difference, which is why I tend to vote for pre-1997 races. But if people want to vote 1997 onwards, thats their decision!
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Has to be 1989
A great charge by Mansell and one of the most spectacular overtaking manoeuvres I've ever seen. I actually prefer it to his famous pass on Piquet at Silverstone.
I believe Mansell was also the only man to overtake Senna in 1989.
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While on that thought, could anybody tell me if the BBC had pit lane reporters before ITV took over? Because I don't recall having heard one in any of the classic races so far? Were they perhaps less important because there wasn't any refuelling before 94? (apart from the brief period 82-83 i know)
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swrcsky
Jonathan Palmer was pitlane reporter back then, until he became co-commentator after the death of James Hunt. Not sure who took over from Palmer though.
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ah i remember now, Tony Jardine took over the pitlane duties from 1993-1997
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Satellite viewing of classic GPs is fine, but please if possible influence BBC to allow them to be shown at 4mbs video bitrate - this allows for nice quality.
Ok... my vote here is 1989 #1, and 1988 #2. A secondary full BBC highlights programme would be outstanding (if possible)!
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I think Hill in the Arrows was the best even with the sad ending but still awesome drive from Damon in a poor car!
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gutbomber
Thanks for that, wasn't aware they were both pit reporters at one stage!
Given James Allen went from pit lane to commentary (like Palmer) does that mean in a few years Ted will be the commentator...? Dunno if i'd like him as a commentator but I do think he does an excellent job as a reporter
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1997? - The one where Damon Hill overtook Schumacher in an Arrows and then had a gearbox problem at the end and lost to Villneuve.
I watched it on holiday in France on a very grainy portable black and white tv with a French commentator and would be great to see it again.
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Shame we can't have 1998, but 1988 would be good please.
Keep up the excellent coverage, it's great to be able to watch the friday sessions.
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I'm gonna vote for 1989.
If there's any chance of a 2nd extended highlight I'm also voting for 1986.
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It's 2006 hands-down for me. I started watching Formula One in 1999 so it's the ONLY good Hungarian GP I've ever seen. The whole weekend was jusr fascinating. Alonso was given a time-penalty for qualifying because in practice he was driving VERY dangerously alongside Robert Doornbos (I'm not sure how he spelt that), which was also much more dangerous than Michael Schumacher's mishap in Monaco qualifying that year. Schumacher also got a time penalty for overtaking under a yellow flag during practice. Those two drivers were incredibly fast in that qualifying session, but because of their time penalties ended up in the middle of the pack. The race was wet at the start and Schumacher and Alonso made incredible starts. Kimi was on pole was was so dissapointing and collided with someone. Alonso's suspension failed while in the lead and under pressure from Button, then it looked like Schumacher would catch Button before his tyres went off and he ended up naging into someone and retiring, only to get a point because Kubica was disqualified!
Incredible race! Extended highlights please Benson!
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1998!!!!!!!!!!
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1990, and it needs full highlights to do it justice
2nd choice: 1997
3rd: 1989
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It has to be 1997. Damon Hill overtaking Schumacher in an Arrows and then had a problem at the end and lost to Villneuve. It was heartbreaking. He was world champ in a crap car [sorry arrows] and yet here he was leading a race at his favourite circuit. And then he starts to break down and creaps round the last lap. And villeneuve still had to put a wheel on the grass to overtake!
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I would love to watch 1997 again as heartbreaking as it is , but as is always mentioned, only 5 minute highlights are available (I will just have to dig out the video of the race). Thus I would like to see 1989 - Mansell qualifying 12th and then winning, fantastic drive. Third choice would be 1993 for Damon's first win.
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1989!
Showing that overtaking at the Hungaroring is possible!
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@Senna27: Completely agree with you. I have seen lots of people on these blogs explain the voting system and how we get short highlights videos of post 97 races no matter what. I know you've always been calm when repeatedly explaining the rules.
As for Stevvy and Lord L, well, I don't think they understand what is being said. Senna27 has obviously explained what will happen several times, and now Andrew has explained it. No-one is saying that post 97 races are dull and should not be shown. In my opinion 06 and 97 were 2 of the best ever hungarian races, but the fact that we get 5-9 minutes of them whether people vote for it or not means I don't need to vote for it to see the all of the highlights that could be shown. Instead I wanted to see 1989, which is also one of my favourite races, as we may get the full length highlights of this race. If there is anything you still fail to understand, please reply and we'll try and explain it again.
@D_M_N: Even using the 30 minutes highlights video from ITV would still require a lot of effort to put together unless Murray and Martin were commentating.
@Andrew: Thank you for replying to my message about freeview. I hope that you find out why they were shown, and you were not told.
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The difference between Palmer and Allen is that the former was promoted to colour commentator and the latter to lead commentator. James Allen would have been fine commentating alongside someone like Murray Walker or Ben Edwards, but not at the expense of Martin Brundle of course.
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@toybota007: Obviously the BBC (or the people who edit the videos) refuse to put James Allen on them. Why? It just comes out to me as plain stupidness.
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Well, as has been said, classic and Hungary go together about as well as charismatic and Raikonnen! However, I'd have to choose 1989 too.
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Has anyone else noticed that when posting here from IE8, any spaces between sentences are ignored? Seems a bit odd to me....
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It just has to be 1997 To see Damon Hill passing Michael and leading for 95% of the race "In an ARROWS" and then to be robbed a couple of laps from home with what I believe was a failed throttle sensor
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"You tell me which race is your favourite... and I take those views into account...when deciding which event to highlight with a detailed back story on this blog...
"We will make short-ish highlights videos of all five races available on this website and on the BBC red button - which so far has meant between five and nine minutes. But if the winning race falls in the years when the BBC had the F1 contract (ie, before 1997), we will broadcast the full 'Grand Prix' highlights programme of the time."
No disrespect to anyone but I'm with senna on the voting - the only difference voting for post '97 races makes is that if they win, Andrew writes up about them on his blog. No offence Andrew, but I vote to see the half-hour highlights programme.
People do need to understand that they should vote tactically - if 2006 wins, we will only see short highlights of all 5 races. If 1986, 1988 or 1989 win, we will see the full BBC highlights programme that was broadcast on the evening of the race *and the short highlights of the ITV-era races*.
All that voting for an ITV-era race does is give it the moral victory of 'winning' the vote, and robs us of the opportunity to see half-an-hour of archive footage.
Andrew - would it be worthwhile in the future ring-fencing the 'votes' for races the BBC has 'Grand Prix' programmes for - for example this week, if 2006 wins hands-down but 1988 is most popular of the races you have extended highlights for, you show the extended highlights anyway? There seems to be a great deal of angst among people who wish to register their favourite race irrespective of footage and those of us who wish to ensure we see 30 minutes of archive F1.
That way everyone will be happy and ppl like #122 that just don't get it won't continue to frustrate folk like senna and me... ;o)
I'll go with 1989 - Mansell, in a Ferrari, overtaking Senna? What's not to like?!
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ps I'm still grateful for your efforts on this Andrew, and the idea itself... so please don't misinterpret my comments of #134 as criticism of you and/or the BBC... more criticism of the electorate ;o)
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1st 1989 2nd 1988 3rd 1986
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@ toybota007 and mark_r6 - good attempts at trying to simplify the mechanisms of this voting format. However, thus far I count around 40 votes for races falling between 1997-2008!! hehe!
Perhaps a diagram next time? :)
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"1997 was a brilliant race, such a shame for Damon... Please show it, but cut it off before the end and we can all pretend Damon won!"
I think kristofpher is onto something here... Perhaps the BBC should employ people to carefully edit old footage so we can watch alternative endings to our favourite races! Just think, Mansell's exploding tyre costing him the title at Adelaide in '86- "exploding tyre? what exploding tyre...?"
OK, I'm not serious! As for Hungary, I'd like to see 1989 please as I've never seen more than a few seconds of it and it sounds as though '88 and '86 are nowhere near as exciting. From the races I've seen, '97 was heartbreaking (especially as I was only seven!) but 2006 is the best Hungarian Grand Prix I've seen. Though on second thoughts, some skilful editing could change all that...!
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Damon 1997, edge of seat stuff
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Damon 1997 is one of the great Hungary races...but please dont put extended highlights on it, as I dont want the mental torture of having to see Damon give up what would of been one of F1's most famous victories again!
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89 for me too please. I am also surprised that 98 wass not on the list (I'm not a great fan pof the current form of strategy over racing) but that 98 was taking strategy to an art form.
As for 89, the drive was truly heroic... the Mansell over-taking move, well...
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I don't particularly care whether or nor James Allen was commentating on a race, I never had any problem with him.
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1989 please! A truly classic race. At a circuit where it's traditionally held that you can't pass (and evidence does tend to support this), Mansell came from 12th on the grid to take one of his best wins. If nothing else, that race really shows the way to what next season might be like with refuelling banned. Do you spend practice concentrating on a good qualifying setup, or do you get your car working well with fuel on board for the race?
1997 was good, but as we won't get extended highlights, it's pointless voting for it as we'll get to see the same coverage if it doesn't win. As for 2006 - sorry, but too recent for me, and I'm a Button fan.
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Senna27, as you have been counting the amount of times people have voted for a post-1997 race, I have counted a fair few digs and remarks about other contributers to this thread from yourself.
And, I'm also afraid, that you have missed the point also, by getting your knickers in a twist far too easily.
I'm telling you to stop yelling at people for voting post-1997, they are simply stating that that particular event is they're favourite from the examples Andrew has given us. Whatever gets the 30 minute honours is fine, and others are voting for that, but there is no stopping people just discussing their GENERAL favourite here. I never saw such a kill-joy.
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1997 gets my vote, Damon's finest hour right there and always the race I point to for his critics.
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1989 is a definite first choice, and 1988 second choice, we've had quite a few '86 races already, and obviously we only get short highlights of the other two.
Also, do two pre-1997 races have to fill the top two positions in voting for there to be two extended highlights programmes? I thought it strange there was only one for the British and German GPs (1987 and 1982 respectively)!
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Lord_Lancashire, I can't help but feel that you're being deliberately obtuse over this matter.
Senna27 from the word go has been trying to ensure people know how to best use their vote, and I applaud him for his efforts. It would be a tragic waste not to maximise our chance at the BBC archive.
It is very clear that many people come onto this blog with little understanding of how the voting works, and it's important for people to be reminded.
We're not trying to stop a discussion, by all means have it; but we're trying to ensure that people know the facts, to limit posts like #107 and #123.
For my 2 cents on 2006 Hungary: the race is a classic, but Button got lucky. Alonso had the race well under control before he had his mechanical failure, and that's ignoring the fact that Raikkonen was leading before he got shunted out.
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Lord_Lanc,
You are taking quite a fancy to me....you'll make the others jealous soon!
If anybody is yelling it is you! I merely serve to inform people that their votes for any post 1996 race is not only a waste of vote, but also a waste of bandwith. Yes, people are free to state their favourte race, but the point of this blog is to 'vote' for the race they wish to have braodcasted, smething you yourself have completely missed time and again! : ) "1997 gets my vote" "It just has to be 1997" etc etc. If you do not recognise them as votes, then you attended a very different linguistics school to what I did!
Re-read Andrew's instructions again:
"You tell me which race is your favourite by responding below, and I take those views into account ( I do count up the 'votes', but this is not a vote, per se) when deciding which event to highlight with a detailed back story on this blog next week.
We will make short-ish highlights videos of all five races available on this website and on the BBC red button - which so far has meant between five and nine minutes. But if the winning race falls in the years when the BBC had the F1 contract (ie, before 1997), we will broadcast the full 'Grand Prix' highlights programme of the time."
If being informative is considered yelling, again, I would love to take a butchers at your school of semantics!
Kisses
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My dear, darling Senna27, wo whom I take such a massive liking to - it is perhaps best we do not discuss this matter again. I could reason with a telegraph pole and still obtain a better result.
Full respect to your point, but do it less agressively in the future - I'm not going to tar this thread with bouts of anger anymore, and you should do likewise.
End of story.
Many, many kisses for you.
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1989
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Lord Lanc...please speak for yourself regarding "anger". Like i've mentioned earlier and like others have oberserved, I have merely been informing of the voting stucture and how to get maximum value from each 'vote'. Rather than thanking me and others for pointing it out, you develop an interesting fixation on me and deluded perspective that I am somehow aggressive wth my posts!
Please, be my guest to reason with a telegraph pole in future and best of luck!
Anyway, back to the races in question. Another interesting race was 1987, Mansell (Williams) and Berger driving a back-to-form Ferrari fighting for the lead. Mansell then loses a wheel nut (what is it about Mansell and wheelnuts/wheels) to hand bitter rival Piquet a win. Not a bad race by any stretch of the imagination.
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89 with 88 if 2nd is to be shown.
My favourite race of these is 97, but seeing as we are shown 5 minute highlights of it regardless I'm gonna utitlise part of my cognitive faculty and vote for my fav pre-97 race. You all are empowered to do the same.. you can do it!
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REF 54
2003 and 2006 - and i don't give two hoots about the voting system...
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1988, 1997, 1989, 2006 and then whatever.
Hungaroring is such a tedious track that even one overtake in an entire race can make it a "classic"
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1986
The earlier the better with these classic selections, no matter where it was or who was involved. In this way the history of F1 is brought to a wider audience.
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By far the first choice would be 1989. For several reasons: the first year I got really into F1, an ardent Ferrari and a Mansell fan. He never gave up and always race against all odds. Hungary '89 was a prime example where Mansell drove a brilliant race from 12th on the grid after a poor qualifying. I remember being on the edge of my seat as I saw Mansell race against the clock to catch and pass Senna.
2nd choice = 1990
3rd = 1986
4th = 1988
5th = 1997
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For me 1997 has to be the classic race. I don't really know anything pre-1996 so would be happy to see any of these!
To that end (and to put a stop to all the ridiculous arguing!) if a post 97 race comes first, can't you just show the extended highlights of the highest placed pre-1997 race?
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Couldn't care less about 2006, Jenson didn't really win the race, it was gifted to him.
This track is no contest, it's 1997 everytime, where Damon broke all our hearts, he was the real winner that year.
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People say Jenson didn't deserve to win the race in 2006, but why didn't he? Kimi got taken out, which was partly his fault and Alonso had a bad tyre stop, which was the teams fault. If you watched the race, he started from 12th on the grid after getting a penalty in qualifying and drove his way magnificently through the field. He was catching Alonso by at least half a second per lap. He was also the fastest driver on the track for several laps and made a great choice in the pits about staying on the inters. If Alonso didn't retire, who was to say Jenson would of been very close to him, if not ahead, after the pitstops? And if he wasn't ahead, what was to say he couldn't overtake him? We saw him overtake many others. In no way was it gifted to him. He won it fair and square.
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@ Senna27: I feel drawing a diagram to help people would just make Lanc believe it is a telegraph pole.
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1989 as first choice please, 1997 as second choice.
Andrew, for post-1996 races, you say you need to splice 5-live sound and ITV video, but I'd imagine it'd be a case of synchronising the start times in both streams and then the descriptions should always follow the actions...? More of a problem may be an overall lack of 5-live coverage, as on the radio the F1 coverage vies with other sports for airtime. In that case, I wonder if Murray Walker, for old time's sake, would be willing to record retrospective voiceover?
I wouldn't be so greedy as to ask for a 30-minute slot, but if there's any way to get post-96 winning votes a slot of, say, 15 minutes instead of the usual 8, that'd really be wonderful. Anyway, you're right in saying there's no pleasing us lot: that's what comes of being starved for so long when F1 was on ITV- we just can't get enough! Keep up the great work.
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1997, 2003 and 2006. You just have to.
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88 please!!
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Ok, so i'm going to vote for 1989. I won't get to see it though as i'll be in France.
I'm voting for it for all those that want to see the longer race highlights.
Do enjoy them.
By the way, does anyone on here know who shows F1 in france?
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my vote goes to 1997 because i never saw it and i love to watch the races before i started watching it to see the drivers and cars just before my time, it also sounds good. my next vote is 2006
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A big thanks again to Andrew and the BBC for making these Classic Grand Prix available. This really sets apart the BBC coverage package from ITV and gives younger viewers a chance to see some of the great races from the sport's past. The number of voters is a measure of the success of this feature and it has certainly created some lively debate.
I do think that some people are taking this whole thing a bit seriously in their complaints regarding the voting system, selection of races, lenght of highlights and commentary options. I'm sure Andrew and his team are working to a very tight budget and are doing a great job to provide us with the highlight selections we have. Sure it would be great to see longer highlights of some of the post 1997 races but its not practical as the BBC don't have the rights. I for one would hate to see the BBC can this feature due to the level of complaints which in the main are fairly trivial. Even where a post '97 race has received a lot of votes Andrew has been very fair in providing at least one of the older races in extended highlights format at each of the races so far.
Let's if we can't all just vote for the races which we want to see and then sit back and savour the highlights (short or long). If your choice doesn't win then there is always next year - provided the whingers don't cause the BBC to bin this feature.
So for my vote - has to be another storming drive from Our Nige in 1989.
Suggestions for Classic European Grand Prix - 1985 Brands Hatch and Mansell's first win (at last!!) after Senna and Rosberg collected one another. 1993 Senna's fantastic first lap in the wet at the possible home of the British GP. Surely no-one can moan if you include those Andrew!
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I'd pick 1989, I've only seen Mansell's pass on Senna from that race, so that'd be good to see
Second I'd choose 1986, the battling Brazilians of Piquet and Senna
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1989 for definite!
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How come 92 doesnt even get a mention, mansell finally winning the title and more overtaking than u can shake a stick at (mostly from mansell) a great race, so very suprised its not on the list.
Anyway out of the above would have to say 86 and 89 are the stand outs from that list as well as the more recent 2006, 89 being my favourite (dont forget Mansell started 12th!).
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Hungary 2006
fantastic to Button win his first grand prix
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re: #164
TF1 (tf1.fr) are showing F1 at 13:55 local time. Chit chat build up programme at 13:20
TF1 is a terrestrial channel, so should be no problems if you can find a TV, but loads of adverts !
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First choice has to be '89, great battle between adopted Italian 'Il Leone' and Senna, then '88 what a year that was for the mighty MP4-4 and its dueling drivers. Finally '86 will be great to watch another battle between the two legendary Brazilians.
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Please can it be 2006!!!!!! Jensons first maiden victory..The hairs on my neck were standing up and shivers down my spine with Anthony Davidson commentating as well watching Jenson carefully driving around circuit
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1989 and 1997 please.
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realbrawngp, it WON'T be ITV commentary for 2006, regardless of whether Anthony is commentating or not.
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Hi ianhaycox, thanks for the info.
Kind regards
lordwoz
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I don't care how many races from the 90s, 1998 was arguably one of the greatest pieces of individual driving in modern times.
It is without question the most remarkable Hungarian Grand Prix.
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